Re: 5 approaches -- the Carlos view
From: jrh (no_at_spam.com)
Date: 10/12/04
- Next message: jrh: "Re: rectal abscess misdiagnosed as prostatitis"
- Previous message: jrh: "Re: ok boys and girls heres the answer"
- Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ]
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:40:32 GMT
In article <20040915162254.04552.00002380@mb-m27.aol.com>,
northernspy1@aol.com says...
>
>For those who "can't sit" there seem to be a bunch of approaches. This is my
>attempt to summarize them.
>
>I'm sure there are mistakes, incomplete statements, misleading parts, and
>subliminal cupcake recipes in here -- I'm just a dude what hurts, and claim
no
>medical knowledge. But perhaps this will help someone organize their
>investigation, as it guides mine.
>
>In brief... there are several approaches, and each has a mainstream side, and
>an extremist side, and a lot of debate about which is which. Another
thing...
>is some of this relates to prostatitis, and some of it undoubtedly does not
>(the assumption being that pain upon sitting may have several causes).
>
>I have little ego wrapped up in this -- anyone who wants to point out the
>especially stupid parts is encouraged to do so.
>
> - Carlos
>
>==== 09.15.04 summary == sitting and prostate pain === Carlos speaks! ==
>[1] INFECTION APPROACH
>
>The infection approach says bacteria or other infectious agents explain
>everything, even if you can't prove the existence of any particular bug.
Many
>people seem to better or cured by antibiotics. The downside is you can't
take
>antibiotics forever, and some have nasty side effects.
>
>Not all antibiotics are the same. There are things Zithromax and Doxycycline
>kill that Cipro and Levaquin will not. Just because you failed with a month
of
>Cipro or Bactrim doesn't mean something else might not work.
>
>There is also a debate about WHY antibiotics work. One view is they only
work
>because they are anti-inflammatory, not because they're killing bugs. Another
>is they are anti-inflammatory BECAUSE they are killing bugs.
>
>On the quack side, some people take antibiotics for years (in small amounts),
>or get them intravenously, or get them injected directly into the prostate.
>
>Prostate drainage is an old technique of squishing the prostate (by a gloved
>hand inside the rectum) which may be useful especially if you are on
>antibiotics (the theory is you remove fluid that may contain bacteria).
(some
>people think drainage helps because it's a kind of massage, relaxing trigger
>points). But it's difficult to find someone who knows how to do it, and some
>speculate it has dangers (pressure causing injury, or spreading infection,
>among them).
>
>One big debate is whether and how to culture to evaluate the possibility of
>infection. A minority have testable bacterial prostatitis, take antibiotics,
>and are cured. More intensive testing (5 day tests, tests of semen as well
as
>urine) reveal more bacteria, but not necessarily the bacteria that is causing
>the pain.
>
>[2] TRIGGER POINT
>
>This approach says that pain makes muscles tighten, and after
>weeks/months/years of being tight in the wrong way (as a pain defense) they
>stay that way even after the pain is gone.
>
>Treatment can include:
>
>- trigger point massage (http://www.ic-network.com/md/ptlistings.html)
>
>- drugs that relax the pelvic floor (that baclofen and klonopin and dilatan)
>(Dr. Guercini of Rome)
>
>- Various injections (numbing agents, or on the more radical fringe, botox)
>into muscles.
>
>In my ignorant view, this mixes cause and effect. Sure, if you have a point
of
>pain, muscles tighten to protect, and in time the infection might be gone but
>the muscles remain in appropriately strong or inappropriately conditions.
But
>my guess is as long as pain remains, the source of the pain remains. And if
>there is any science here, why do different massage therapists come to such
>different conclusions with respect to particular patients.
>
>Trigger point may mostly be pain management, not a cure -- but hey, pain
>management that works is good.
>
>[3] NEUROLOGICAL
>
>Mainstream medicine recognizes that sitting on a narrow bicycle seat, or an
>injury (fall from a ladder) can cause neurological damage. Treatment is:
>
>- waiting for nerves and blood vessels to regrow while avoiding the activity
>(bicycling, sitting) that cause the injury
>
>- oral steroids, anti inflammatory (palliative more than treatment)
>
>Put another way, if excessive bicycling on a narrow seat caused problems
>(numbness, or urinary or erectile) then don't bicycle. Maybe even sit less.
>Walk. You'll get better, though it may take months.
>
>The freak side of the neurological approach claims the pain is the result of
an
>"entrapped" nerve -- not just injured, but stuck between ligaments that are
>grinding it making it worse. It's not proven that the pudendal nerve is EVER
>entrapped and what a lot of the PNE crowd considers their "gross abnormality"
>is something they somehow lived with without pain for years. Can you say
>QUACK?!
>
>The tests that "prove" entrapment are crackers. Pudendal nerve blocks cure
no
>one, and a serious percentage (over 25% on my extremely informal and
>unscientific test) get permanently worse. And IMO they have no diagnostic
>value re: "entrapment". And the "cure" for entrapment -- surgery -- has NO
>statistics despite years of operations.
>
>[4] ANATOMICAL
>
>There are many structural reasons that can explain your symptoms (whatever
they
>are). They can include:
>
>- a spinal injury or cyst
>
>- testicular or prostate cyst or tumor
>
>- a urinary stricture which causes "urinary reflux" (chemical inflammation)
>
>Now try and find a doctor who will methodically test you for all the
>possibilities!
The unmentioned posibility:
An undiagnosable / mis diagnosed, anorectal disorder leads to
the infection of the prostate, and causes an autoimmune response,
circulation problems, prostate problems, joint problems, etc.
>[5] EVERYTHING ELSE
>
>I've seen chiropractors who claim to have made progress treating this stuff.
>
>Oh, and herbal -- that's a big one. Many men (at least with enlarged
prostates
>that appear not to have cancer or bacterial infection) are helped by
Quercetin,
>or Saw Palmetto, etc., etc.
>
>For pain that is sitting-specific (in other words, no accompanying urinary,
>prostate or epididymal symptoms) there may be other nonbacterial infections
>(Google "Bursitis")
>
>MANY medical theories
> - an autoimmune disease
> (the inflammation is a body reaction, not an external agent)
an alergic reaction to self
> - an allergy (same as autoimmune reaction?)
an alergic reaction to a forign substance
questions:
is sperm a forign substance?
can alergic reactions can esclate into an autoimmune reaction?
once an autoimmune reaction is established, can it be cured?
> When substantive treatment fails, try pain management.
> Oh, and something about hormones. This guy is a great resource for all of
> this:
> GENERALLY http://www.geocities.com/bill3320/
> HORMONE THEORY http://www.geocities.com/bill3320/hormones.html
Interesting,
- Next message: jrh: "Re: rectal abscess misdiagnosed as prostatitis"
- Previous message: jrh: "Re: ok boys and girls heres the answer"
- Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ]
Relevant Pages
|
