Re: Capt. of USS San Fransico reassingned

From: George William Herbert (gherbert_at_retro.com)
Date: 01/29/05 

Date: 29 Jan 2005 09:49:35 GMT

stmx3 <stmx3@netscape.net> wrote:
>Apparently this wasn't a direct head-on collision, but yet it wasn't a
>glancing blow either. I see no further damage along the port side or
>on the port fairwater plane so it looks like just the one single
>contact. Also, there must have been a significant side load because,
>if you look at the bulkhead between MBTs 1 & 2, you'll see it is bowed
>in the forward direction (not aft, like you'd expect from a near
>head-on collision). So, I'd say a 45 - 50 angle on the bow hit.
>OR...a 20 deg AOB hit, slewing the boat 25-30 degrees as it absorbs
>energy along the path of least resistance (i.e. not directly along the
>longitudinal bulkhead (between MBT 1A and 1B). And I've also heard
>that, as the boat dropped instantaneously from ~30kts to 4kts, it took
>a large up angle...so perhaps theres damage further along the bottom.
>I'd love to see a simulation model of the accident.

Actually, something has been bothering me since I saw these
detailed photos, and I finally have decided I have to pose
the question and see what the rest of you think.

Comparing the two drydock hires images, it's clear that
while there's signficant damage to the side and upper
port quadrant of the #1 and 2 ballast tanks (if I'm
correctly interpreting Derek's labeling). But the bottom
is more or less intact, with one frame's worth of crumple
in tertiary overload failure.

Ok. You're a submarine proceeding underwater and you
hit a head on to head on / glancing blow on an underwater
solid mountain obstacle.

Say this mountain has a purely vertical flat wall that you
hit at about a 45 degree angle. So the nose and port side
of the nose are damaged, etc. Fine. But the damage should
be more or less symetrical top and bottom.

Say this mountain is like most mountains, somewhat conical
so there's not a straight vertical wall but it leans back
some as it goes up. So you hit it, as say a 45 degree
angle. Same damage pattern, except that you expect
*more* damage on the bottom now.

How, exactly, do you hit a mountain and have more damage
on the *top* quadrant than the bottom?

That would seem to indicate an obstacle with a greater than
90 degree slope, some sort of overhang or something.

Now, I've seen underwater topology with vertical cliff faces.
I've seen underwater topology with very slight overhangs.
But enough to do that sort of damage?

The only credible thing I can think of is that it was a
fairly vertical wall, but that the bottom of the hull
has more structure down there for some reason,
and while the upper lobe more or less just got ripped
off the lower lobe just got compressed in somewhat but
basically survived.

The alternatives all seem too bizarre. A serious overhang?
The sub rolled over to port before impact? Subs don't normally
do that...

-george william herbert
gherbert@retro.com

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