Re: GOD=G_uv A MESSAGE TO "Max"

From: George Hammond (research137_at_hotmail.com)
Date: 08/16/04 

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 01:40:13 GMT

"Scot McDermid" <scotmc@optNOSPAMonline.net> wrote in message
news:hEOTc.3123$5b4.1682241@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
>
> "Alan" <gper@mindless.com> wrote in message
> news:847702a8.0408150825.475d0257@posting.google.com...

> I agree with Alan. The God of the Bible is not Hammond's Guv.
>

[Hammond]
Alan's arguments have been totally trashed by the following reply from
Hammond:

"Alan" <gper@mindless.com> wrote in message
news:847702a8.0408150825.475d0257@posting.google.com...
> [snip]
> > > So maybe you could start with one simple
> > > question: Did God create the universe?
> >
> > [Hammond]
> > YES, unequivocally, YES. God DID create the universe
> > and its time you understood what they are talking about
> > when they say that.....!!
> [snip]
>
>
>
> > What they're talking about when they say "God created
> > the universe" is THIS:
> > The human brain creates OUR IMAGE of actual physical
> > reality. Without this image there IS NO REALITY.
>
>
> But actual physical reality exists without this image. I fully expect
> actual physical reality to exist even after we're all dead. Don't you?

[Hammond]
Contrary to your expectations, the ANSWER IS NO !!!
The World would not exist if we were all dead!

First, let me say I am exceedingly grateful to have your focused
attention on this CRUCIAL issue.
   This point is PROVEN using advanced physics and experimental
evidence and has been published. I PRESUME that you are
not a trained scientist, however I will therefore proceed to try
and explain this point HEURISTICALLY and see if I can get
through to you. I APPRECIATE YOUR ATTENTION!

First, let us examine what the statement "the world would exist
even if we were all dead" actually means. What it means is
"if we were suddenly to reappear, the world would still be here".
But this negates the original proposition which says that we
are all dead. So we see that the statement is actually a contradiction
in terms. The statement is meaningless.
  There is a simple reason why the statment is meaningless. The fact is
that the world "exists" actually means:

  "exists" = "is existing" = "is observable by a human being"

obviously, if there "are no human beings" it is NOT observable by
a human being. In FACT:

     The "existence" of something depends sine qua non
      on the "existence" of a human being. There is no
      such thing as "existence" without the existence of a
      human being to "create its existence". "Existence" is a
      physical property of the human perceptual system.

The reason for this is that Science CANNOT define "mass, length and
time" EXCEPT by reason of human "intuition". There IS NO
definition of "mass, length and time" other than the process of holding
up a brass cylinder of "mass" and a platinum rod of "length" and asking
for a "majority vote
of intuitive opinion" as to whether these represent EXAMPLES of
what is commonly "opined" to be "mass, length and time". Any physicist
will confirm this. The concept and "definition" of "mass, length and time"
is SOLELY BASED on the existence of a HUMAN PERCEPTUAL
INSTINCT. They have no "existence" apart from the perceptual
system of a human being!
     Ergo.... if all human beings die tomorrow, MASS, LENGTH AND TIME
die with them!!!!! The "universe" and "reality itself" dies with them.
Of crucial importance, is that "TIME" itself does not exist without the
existence of Man. Therefore, "TIME" itself was "CREATED" when Man
was created, 40,000 years ago. This "creation of time" includes a
15 Billion year old "Big Bang" and billion year old fossils. "Age" is
not the same thing as "time itself". "time itself" was created when Man
was created,
and "Time itself" was CREATED 40,000 years ago and already contained
a 15 billion year history!!

Now... I shouldn't think that this is beyond your comprehension. And I
would
point out it was obvious to many great men long before the invention of
modern science. For instance in 300 AD Saint Augustine said it himself
when he said:

         "the world was created WITH time, not IN time."
                                        (Saint Augustine)

He understood EXACTLY what I have just explained to you, and which
is now PROVEN by modern science.

>
>
> > So therefore.... the "creation of the brain" is a
> > "creation of reality". This is what the "Biblical Creation"
> > actually is..... the "creation of the brain" 40,000 years ago.
>
>
> But that isn't what anyone else that I know of believes.

[Hammond]
Saint Augustine believed it. The entire Christian Science
Church in modern times, believes it. Hammond has now
SCIENTIFICALLY PROVED it.

> We all KNOW
> that we have our "personal reality", which first started when we
> became cognizant of ourselves and the world around us. So? "Creation"
> is understood, by everyone else that I know of, to represent actual
> physical reality.

[Hammond]
All we really know is that the human perceptual system creates
an "image we call reality).... i.e. the 5 senses. What the absolute
nature of what it is perceiving is, we have no way of knowing.
All we really KNOW is that we can't know anything beyond
the "perceptual map" produced by our 5 senses.... and if
our 5 senses all die tomorrow.... then this perceptual construct
called "reality' disappears with us.

>
> >
> > Now, its true that "actual physical reality" was created
> > 15-billion years ago in the Big Bang.
>
>
> And that's the REAL question about God's existence, since theists
> believe that God created actual physical reality. Did He (She? It?) or
> didn't He?

[Hammond]
"Absolute physical reality" is only a convenient hypothesis... in fact it
is an "unobservable". the only thing we observe is "perceptual reality"
and it is a know fact that "perceptual reality" disappears if man
disappears.
  Of course... let me anticipate the PRACTICALITY of this statement
by pointing out that "human perceptual reality" can be MODIFIED
by brain growth, since human perceptual reality depends crucially on
the BRAIN. This is the practical point of all this discussion, because
it turns out that "brain growth" crucially modifies "perceptual reality"
and this PHENOMENON is the CAUSE of both RELIGION and GOD!
  And THAT is why we are actually here talking about all this...
NOT because it is of some abstract Philosophical importance!

>
> >
> > But that doesn't matter.
>
>
> It may not matter to YOU. Since everyone else that I know of is
> concerned, in the question of God's existence, with the creation of
> the actual physical universe, it DOES matter.

[Hammond]
NO.. it doesn't matter to St. Augustine, and it doesn't matter
to the Christian religion and its 1.3 billion followers.. The only people
it matters to are a handful of misguided scientific hobbyists and
woefully uninformed counter culture enthusiast like you.

>
>
> > Until MAN is created (40,000 years ago)
> > to SEE IT..... then it doesn't EXIST. You can't have an
> > "OBSERVABLE" without and "OBSERVER".
>
>
> Sounds like the Copenhagen Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics, which
> HAS NOT been "proven", nor is it universally accepted by top-notch
> physicists - in fact, nowadays the majority of top-notch physicists
> would probably not support this view. If you CALL something
> "observable", then you are REFERRING to it as being able to be
> observed, which implies an observer. That's mere definition, a
> tautology. If nothing is "observable" because no observers exist, you
> have nowhere demonstrated that actual physical reality does not exist
> - and it IS actual physical reality that everyone else is referring to
> when they speak of creation. We KNOW our own, individual, perceived
> "universes" would not exist if we did not - that is OBVIOUS - "my"
> universe would not exist if "I" did not - but "creation", by everyone
> else's definition, refers to "the" universe (the actual physical one),
> rather than our own individually perceived "universes".

[Hammond]
You're simply going around and around in circles with your erroneous
tautology. The fact that you need an OBSERVER to define the
term OBSERVABLES in physics predates quantum mechanics by many
centuries. PHYSICS has simply never concerned itself with the
question of the "existence of the observer". However, it turns out
there IS a question of the "existence of the observer" and this is called
the
"theory of God" and it has now achieve a SCIENTIFIC PROOF by
Hammond 2003.

>
> >
> > The "OBSERVABLE" was created 15-Billion years ago, but the
> > "OBSERVER" was only created 40,000 years ago.
> > The first is called the "Big Bang"
> > The second is called "Biblical Creation".
>
>
> But in Biblical Creation, God created Man, pre-existed Man, and was in
> no way dependent on Man for his own existence. How does this
> reconcile with your theory?

[Hammond]
A. God created himself
B. God created Man at the same time as himself
     because he created "time itself" when he created Man
     and the World. And this is called "Creation".

>
> > BOTH are absolutely scientifically REAL.
>
>
> That human observers only came on the scene recently (relative to the
> Big Bang) is incontrovertible. Calling THIS "Biblical Creation" has
> not, to anyone's satisfaction but your own, been shown to be
> "scientifically real" -

[Hammond]
Sorry, Saint Augustine and Bishop Ussher, and the Bible,
and the Christian Science Church more recently, ALL
strongly disagree with you and SUPPORT ME.
so quit saying I stand alone.... fact is the entire history
of both Science and religion support me fully.

> and that has nothing to do with relativity,
> psychometry, or even religion. You seem to be trying to "theorize" the
> universe into being in accord with your own, perceived reality -

[Hammond]
No.... that's just one of you PRESUMPTIONS and CHERISHED HOPES,
turns out it has been dashed to smithereens by my discovery of an axiomatic
experimentally proven hard scientific proof. Sorry..... yawn....

> while
> everyone else, besides druggies, try to adjust their perceived
> realities to be in accord with the universe.

[Hammond]
Unfortunately for you... the only hope for the survival of your
pre-scientific proof
beliefs is now to harass me as vigorously as possible and try to SUPPRESS
the discovery.
you DO apparently have the support of your handlers the scientific
establishment).
You will have to use the internet to muster as many hecklers, stalkers,
kooks,
nuts and radicals as you possible can to try and destroy my reputation and
prevent
publication in the leading journals.
   However, your efforts seem to be slipping:

1. The theory has been published in the peer reviewed literature
     and is already sitting in hundreds of copies in libraries and
     subscribers hands

2. 2 million people have visited my websites in the past 4 years
     and the theory God=G_uv is already widely known

3. Scores of the world's leading scientists including Chris Isham,
     Stephen Unwin, the Vatican Observatory and many others have
     already commented on the discovery.

If you're going to make a serious effort to suppress and discredit this
discovery,
you're already running behind the clock.

====================================
   SCIENTIFIC PROOF OF GOD WEBSITE
        1st mirror site:
http://geocities.com/scientific_proof_of_god
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====================================

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