Re: Practical/concept. defenition of "meter", Part2

rotchm_at_yahoo.com
Date: 12/13/04 

Date: 12 Dec 2004 20:59:12 -0800

>> What does k2 indicate? Either it indicates 1/c also OR it doesnt.

>Here is the problem. k2 is not in your frame and is remote from you.
So
>all that can be said is "O1 observes the reading on k2". Because the
only
>thing else that can be said is pretty smarts assy... "k2 indicates
time".
>If you want to infer instantaneous communication so that O1 "knows"
what k2
>indicates for any particular *now* (for O1), then you won't do this in
this
>Universe.

You grasp my point perfectly. But O1 is NOT observing k2 and doesnt
want to. But as you say, we can claim that k2 indicates time. We can
also claim it indicates 1/c or not, independently of the existence of
O1.

No, I dont want to infer instantaneous communication, there is no such
communication in the above experriment, and I dont quite believe in
instantaneous communication.

>> How does all that hold?

>It doesn't. You've got all sorts of instantaneous communication going
on.

No I dont. None whatsoever. Only one flash of light, PR (or PL for
lefties), and that is not communicating anything.

>O1 doesn't have in-frame access to k2, except at t=0. Same for O2 and
>access to k1. So inferences to 1/c only apply *in the one frame*.

Exactly.

>To
>reach further, into the other frame, you have to assume something
about c.
>Since it seems you want to know something about c, then you can't
assume
>*anything* about c.

Precicely my point.

>> Remember that both frames are equivalent. We can start the whole
>> argument with O2 instead of O1.

>Right. But do it without invoking "reality" or "instantaneous
>communication". Base it on measurement, observability, etc.

Do you mean that to analyse such experiments or thoughts, we should not
invoke "reality", we should not try to figure out what is "really"
happening, but just base our stuff on observations?

Magicians really would like that!

Why couldnt I analyse such situations invoking "reality"? what is the
drawback in doing so?

L8r.

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