Re: A Forgotten Prediction of Einstein

Russell wrote:
> Sue... wrote:
> > Russell wrote:
> > > Sue... wrote:
> > > > Russell wrote:
> > > > > Sue... wrote:
> > > > > > Spaceman wrote:
> > > > > > > "Russell" <russell@xxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:1138146027.975514.86880@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > <snipped>
> > > > > > > | between them in that frame. Now, are you asserting that
> > > > > > > | in Annie's frame the shots are simultaneous? That is
> > > > > > > | false, according to SR.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Annies FoR is irrelevant to the reality simply because she is
> > > > > > > not where the now occured and had to wait for light to tel her
> > > > > > > about the 'now'.
> > > > > > > But that is just a lightspeed problem, not a simultaneous-ness prob at all.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The collision is very real evidenced by lead debris on the ground.
> > > > > > Annie's IFB has the same length cable as Bill's so they only
> > > > > > wait for the ringmaster to say 'fire'
> > > > >
> > > > > Right, Bill and Annie do agree (along with everybody else) that
> > > > > the shots occurred simultaneously in the ringmaster's frame.
> > > > > Didn't you understand me to say that? Well, I *did*, but maybe
> > > > > not clearly enough. I hope that that little misunderstanding is
> > > > > cleared up, now.
> > > > >
> > > > > Now, we can get down to the question of what Annie and Bill
> > > > > say wrt their *own* respective frames. That is, if you aren't
> > > > > too scared of being shown up as a fool again.
> > > > >
> > > > > > The lighting crew doesn't even have to show up for work
> > > > > > except that the audience might riot if the performance is
> > > > > > in the dark. :o)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sue...
> > > >
> > > > The debris is real as seen in all FoR.
> > >
> > > Yes, of course.
> > >
> > > But the important (and to some, controversial) question is the
> > > timing of the *shots*. Not the obvious fact that there was a
> > > single impact -- on that, everyone agrees. Sorry if you were
> > > unclear on this up to now but hopefully we are on the same
> > > page now.
> >
Restating:

<<If Annie Oakly and Buffalo Bill are moving relatively on
equal horses and firing equal arms, a mid-point collision
of the bullets is proof they both know what "now' is. >>

>
> This is why I asked you to clarify your position; but evidently
> you are only interested in speaking in riddles.
>
> Assignment of a single time to a single event is not a matter
> of any controversy. (I mean, how duh! can you get?)
>
> The (for newbies) controversial issue is relativity

Annie and Bill are moving relatively, as stated.

< of simultaneity,

They fired simultaneously as proved by mid flight debris.

> which comes into play only when there are *two*
> events that are spacelike
> separated, such as (for example) the respective
> firings of Bill's and Annie's guns.

Annie and Bill fired from *two* different positions in space.

>
> I was giving you the benefit of the doubt by interpreting your
> remark as an intelligent one bearing on the matter of interest
> of SR and its critics here. Apparently I erred in my charitable
> estimation of you. But you can still make amends if you care
> to discuss the real issue of interest here.

Save your charity for someone that would judge
the sunrise from a closed room. Someone might
post Einsten's gedanken with railroad tunnels
added. They'll not only argue when flashes
occured but whether they in fact occured at all.

Sue...

>
> [snip]

.

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