Re: The velocity of light going pass a moving train.

On Jun 21, 4:52 am, BZ <WQAHBGMXS...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Jun 21, 1:33 am, Dono <s...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:





On Jun 20, 10:26 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"Dono" <s...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

news:1182387866.761051.23130@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

On Jun 20, 5:27 pm, "papar...@xxxxxxxxx" <papar...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On 20 jun, 18:29, Dono <s...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jun 19, 11:05 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"Dono" <s...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

news:1182303768.824683.175520@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Yes, I kept trying to get dr.Jeckyll to understand it ......I
already
showed him the formula, to no avail (at least, so far).

You were simply misunderstanding the problem and so coming up with
the wrong
solution.

No, idiot. You simply don't understand aberration, that is all.
If you stopped talking and you started using math you would
understand. But since you avoid using math like the plague, you keep
repeating the same errors.

It helps when you are actually talking about the same problem as
everyone else (G, Harry, myself). As I said .. you were using the
right
formulas but misapplying it (as far as the problem the rest of us
were
talking about).

Again, no, idiot. The description of the problem in math terms is not
as ambigous as you keep making it to be.
Here it is, one more time, mr. Jackasss:

-In the traincar frame theta_car=pi/2
-In the track frame

cos(theta_track)=(cos(theta_car)-v/c)/(1-v/c*cos(theta_car))

So, can you calculate cos(theta_track)? I asked you 5 times, why are
you so shy about using a little math?

Since you don't get the math and you didn't get the "separation speed"
explanation, I will give you a third explanation: since in relativity
all frames are equivalent, instead of having the train moving Left to
Right with respect to the tracks, imagine that the tracks move Right
to Left while the light bounces vertically in the car frame. How is
the light inclined in the track frame? If you still don't get it, look
at these pictures:

http://www.fourmilab.ch/cship/aberration.html

But in those pictures, the observer is in the train frame and he sees
through the window as if the ground is moving from left to right and,
obviously the rain is falling with an angle that clearly is inclined
into the direction of the movement of the ground, again as seen from
the train frame. So those pictures actually contradict what you are
saying.

Miguel Rios

In both cases the light is inclined from right to left,

No .. if the traing goes left to right in the FoR of the tracks, then the
light that is vertical in the train goes left to right in the FoR of the
tracks.

You are using the correct formula .. but applying it incorrectly. BTW: Do
you even understand relativistic aberration works, and why you get a great
difference in angle when you take relativity into accout.

Yes, I do i****. Now check with the guy who was the first to derive
the formula:

http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/einstein/specrel/www/

i.e. it makes an angle greater than 90 degrees with the semipositive
x-axis.
Try understanding the relativistic aberration formula, would you?

How about you try it .. you seem to think the light goes the wrong way

Check with Einstein, you ignorant t***:

http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/einstein/specrel/www/

Do you understand that in the train iFoR, the vertical beam in the
light
clock hits both mirrors 'dead' center, all the time, because the
mirrors
are aligned in the trains iFoR to be parallel?

Correct.



If you see that, then you should realize that a basketball player,
riding
on the train, sitting in his seat, dribbling the ball in the isle,
would
have the ball moving vertically in the trains iFoR.

If you agree with those, then you should realize that from ANY iFoR,
the
light must continue to be seen to hit the mirror in the center and the
ball
to hit the floor and the basketball players hand dead center.

Since the mirrors and the hand are traveling left to right, the light
and
the ball must travel left to right and follow the path that Jeckle
keeps
describing to you.

Incorrect. In the track frame, while the light travelled from the
floor to the ceiling, the train moved from LEFT to RIGHT.
In mathematical terms:

1. In the train frame the light makes an angle pi/2 with the
semipositive x axis, so cos(theta_car)=0

2. The track frame, according to the relativistic aberration formula

cos(theta_track)=(cos(theta_car)-v/c)/(1-v/c*cos(theta_car))

so

cos(theta_track)=-v/c

meaning that , in the track frame, the light wave vector k, makes an
andgle LARGER than pi/2 with the semipositive x-axis

In other words, contrary to what you are saying, the light beam in
inclined towards the REAR of the car as viewed from the frame of the
tracks.
This makes perfect sense, since, as pointed out earlier, the car has
moved from the LEFT to the RIGHT while the light travelled from the
floor to the ceiling.

Now, the above system would not allow for dtection of absolute motion
because, inside the closed car the light moves perfectly vertically
regardless of the car speed v. So, an observer closed inside the car
would not be able to detect any "absolute motion"





.

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