Re: Was Zwicky right?

On Sun, 23 Sep 2007 02:06:09 -0700, mluttgens@xxxxxxxxxx wrote:

[...]


What I have to say is that you systematically and mischievously
takes advantage of a careless mistake.

Is it really careless when you make the mistake then argue about it
for weeks then never admit being wrong?


A. V. Shepelev said:

"Formally the Aristotelian view of motion is realized
instead of Newton's one: a body begins to slow down
with respect to a reference frame linked to the CMBR."

The CMBR is a predicted part of the big bang theory, along with the
distribution of elements in the universe. I wonder how, if at all, he
handles that.
[...]

His claim is unambiguous. Imo, it implies a stable universe.

Except that does not explain the existence or power spectrum of the
CMBR, the structure of the universe, the distribution of elements...


A light ray of wavelength lambda is sent from a point P.
At a distance d from P, the energy loss of a photon of
frequency Nu is

Where does the energy come from / go?
[...]

The energy balance of a stable universe should be zero,
hence, ultimately, the energy of an emitted photon
comes from the universe's energy pool and goes back
to it after a finite time.

So you don't know.

Saying "it boes back" is meaningless handwaving.


One has also

d = (c/H) * z/(1+z)

If one neglects the factor 1+z, one finds back the
old Hubble law.

Uhhhm, no. You can't just neglect the 1/(1+z) term. The object with
the largest z ever seen had z ~ 10.

Looks like you still don't understand the concept of the approximation
or when it is allowable to kick out certain terms.

You are again quibbling.

Uh, no. This is a gross abuse that is simply wrong.

I said "if", which doesn't mean it is allowed. Your exemple of a
z of 10 simply shows that Hubble law is only valid for small z
values.

Except that it isn't. Hubble's law is valid for all z values to a
large degree. It isn't valid in the sense that the expansion is
accelerating [oh, didn't you hear about that?] but that expansion is
small so the linear fit works fine.

Oh, and making the d = (c/H) * z/(1+z) ~ (c/H) * z approximation is
only valid for z >> 1.

Remember Marcel, approximation theory doesn't go away just because you
don't understand it.


Let's note that z becomes infinite when d = c/H.
Such distance d thus corresponds to the radius
of the observable universe.

Which using the currently accepted value of H = 70km/s/mpc, that
corresponds to a distance of 14 thousand billion light years.

Only off by a factor of a thousand.

You just made a gross mistake.
d = c/H can be written d = c * H^-1
When H = 70km/s/mpc, H^-1 is about 14 * 10^9 years.
In 14 * 10^9 years, c travels a distance of 14 * 10^9 light-years,
which represents the radius of the observable universe.

D'oh. Units mismatch. I was using the meter definition of the parsec
and the kilometer together, which explains the factor of a thousand.




***

Otoh, don't speak of other people incompetence.
You have amply demonstrate your own in

http://groups.google.fr/group/sci.physics.relativity/browse_frm/threa...

Why don't you explain why I'm the incompetent one in the thread in
which you claim something isn't an angle because it doesn't have pi in
it and that the GR formula is wrong because it has the wrong units [it
didn't, as I demonstrated]?

Again your psittacosis!

Marcel Luttgens
.

Relevant Pages

  • 13 things that do not make sense
    ... The horizon problem ... Dark matter ... Maybe output from parallel brane universe?; ... thing called conscious energy that regular biochemistry ...
    (sci.physics)
  • =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A_Schr=F6dinger=27s_Universe?=
    ... Wolff's brand new book: Schrödinger's Universe. ... all electrons give and receive tiny bits ... But both the positron's scalar and spin frequencies are 180 degrees ... quanta bits, the same as energy. ...
    (sci.edu)
  • Re: The Universes Next Door
    ... >also a dark energy exotic vacuum blob that is more stable than ... >Vilenken's thin vacuum domain wall. ... The topology is generally mutiply connected with Betti numbers ... This is familiar in GR where the universe recedes ...
    (sci.math)
  • GRAVITATION AND QUANTUM MECHANICS
    ... PLANETS ORBIT THE SUN TO CONSERVE TOTAL ENERGY ... A planet or any mass such as the earth orbits the sun ... The potential energy of the rest of the universe ...
    (sci.astro)
  • Re: THE MECHANICS OF THE UNIVERSE
    ... radius L to conserve total energy. ... fundamental equation of the universe. ... relative to the rest of the effective universe and potential ... A force of gravity would not be possible without ...
    (sci.physics)