Re: Are *observed* SR effects real?

Darwin123 wrote:
On Jul 28, 2:26 pm, PD <TheDraperFam...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 28, 12:17 pm, mluttg...@xxxxxxxxxx wrote:
Now, Spaceman is of the opinion that if the physical cause of time
dilation is not attributed to a malfunction of the clock, then the
real physical cause has not been found.

You are greatly overestimating Spaceman.
Spaceman's claim is that if ANY physical cause of the time
dilation is found, then it is by definition a malfunction. Thus, he
has set up a tautology.
I restate Spaceman's tautology as follows. If there is no physical
cause of the time dilation, then the theory of relativity is
unscientific because science has to have real physical causes.
However, if a physical cause is found, then the clocks by definition
have malfunction. Then the experimental evidence for relativity is
unscientific because no scientific experiment can use a malfunctioning
clock.
One can substitute "rubber ruler" for "malfunctioning clock" in
most of Spaceman's other arguments against relativity. If there is a
physical cause for the ruler shrinking, then the ruler was rubber.
Since rubber rulers shouldn't be used in scientific experiments, the
discovery of a physical cause for "length contraction" makes the
conclusions null and void.
There is no logical way around this tautology. Relativity is
unscientific in Spaceman's view, even if all experiments agree with it
and physical causes are found for all the results. There is absolutely
no way around this tautology.
This tautology is not original. There is an apparent misconception
that relativity doesn't involve physical causes.
He's simply not willing to
entertain a cause that is not of the form he wants.

He doesn't want a physical cause. A "physical cause" is by his
definition a "malfunction." He knows very well that the HK experiment
agreed with relativity, not Newtonian, physics. He has defined
"physical cause" so as to make relativity false, even if the cause is
found.
I grabbed both horns of the Spaceman dilemma by citing a physical
cause (centripetal force) and agreeing that it was a malfunction. I
pointed out that many miracles of modern technology, such as the GPS,
use malfunctioning clocks. He gave up.
Fortunately, you seem to be a little less bound up, though I see it
continues to be a struggle.

I think some of the problems with relativity that some novices
have can be resolved using force diagrams. When a paradox occurs, the
symmetry breaking mechanism is almost always a force. I define the
symmetry breaking mechanism, whatever it is, as a physical cause. What
many people want to see is symmetry breaking mechanism. In the case of
the HK experiment, the symmetry breaking mechanism is the centripetal
force.

Correct about not being able to prove me wrong.
But wrong about me not wanting to find a "true" physical cause.
The physical cause is what I want, not the stupidity of "spacetime"
where multiple standards are converted to a physical cause.

--
James M Driscoll Jr
Creator of the Clock Malfunction Theory
Spaceman



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Relevant Pages

  • Re: twin paradox, but a symmetric one
    ... Spacetime Physics, by Taylor and Wheeler ... General Relativity, by Robert Geroch ... Heading towards each, one sees the other as ticking faster. ... One observer is heading toward the clock, ...
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  • Re: Electron-positron annihilation
    ... >> the fallacious arguments used by those who don't understand relativity, ... in physics, who worked on tunneling processes in QM, where *apparent* ... that even their PhD advisor said that the book is nonsense... ... > a clock at the equator would run slower than one at the pole and not the ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: Electron-positron annihilation
    ... >> the fallacious arguments used by those who don't understand relativity, ... in physics, who worked on tunneling processes in QM, where *apparent* ... that even their PhD advisor said that the book is nonsense... ... > a clock at the equator would run slower than one at the pole and not the ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
  • Re: Einsteins disservice to physics
    ... Recall his unique service to Physics through ... constant c in all inertial frames K1, K2, K3 etc. in relative uniform ... This distinguishes Special Relativity from Galilean relativity and is ... talk of length contraction or time dilation or clock ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
  • Re: Dear Spaceshit....
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    (sci.physics)
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