Re: Virtual Particles

From: Arnold Neumaier (Arnold.Neumaier_at_univie.ac.at)
Date: 09/28/04 

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 15:20:10 +0000 (UTC)

Uncle Al wrote:
> Ian Taylor wrote:
>
>>A number of people here have stated that virtual particles are not
>>"real", and just a calculational device. This has confused me for two
>>reasons
>>
>>1. I was always taught that particles such as electrons are
>>indistinguishable, so that if you swap two electrons around you would
>>never be able to tell. So if a virtual electron-antielectron pair is
>>created, if we could somehow swap the virtual electron for a real
>>electron how would we know ? However this indistinguishability idea
>>seems (to me at least) to be at variance with the view that virtual
>>particles are not real

>>
>>2. In Stephen Hawking's calculation of a black hole's temperature, the
>>physical picture painted is that a virtual pair of particles appears
>>near the event horizon, and one falls in to the black hole, and the
>>other is emitted (at least this is how I have seen it explained). In
>>this case the virtual particles (which according to some don't really
>>exist) somehow become real !
>>
>>Clearly I am of the view that virtual particles are just as real as
>>real particles, but I am prepared to change my mind if someone puts
>>forward a sufficiently convincing argument to the contrary.

This is explained at length in the secition
''How real are 'virtual particles'?'' of my theoretical physics FAQ at
      http://www.mat.univie.ac.at/~neum/physics-faq.txt

If you don't find this convincing, please state your reasons, and
I'll improve the argumentation.

> Casmir effect, Lamb shift, Rabi vacuum oscillations, electron
> anomalous g-factor... How would you rationalize the Casimir effect,
> an etalon excluding virtual modes to measurable effect with force
> varying as the inverse fourth power of the separation, as "just a
> calculational device?"

Of course, physicists would not talk of virtual particles if the concept
had no relevance at all. However, in terms of real particles, the
above effects all show up as a consequence of renormalized, effective
interactions. Only these have a real meaning in terms of observable
effects.

Arnold Neumaier

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