Re: Neutrino Mass and Supernovae

From: Dale Trynor (dalet_at_nbnet.nb.ca)
Date: 09/17/04 

Date: Fri, 17 Sep 2004 07:12:51 GMT

Ken S. Tucker wrote:
> Bjoern Feuerbacher <feuerbac@thphys.uni-heidelberg.de> wrote in message news:<cici7a$fpl$4@news.urz.uni-heidelberg.de>...
>
>>Ken S. Tucker wrote:
>>
>>>Bjoern Feuerbacher <feuerbac@thphys.uni-heidelberg.de> wrote in message news:<ci9qeh$9jc$1@news.urz.uni-heidelberg.de>...
>
>
> [snip]
>
>
>>>However when phi < 0 then C > c. From this we can tabulate,
>>>
>>> m>0, v<c
>>> m=0, v=c
>>> m<0, v>c
>>
>>"m" denotes the central mass here. So we can conclude: in the
>>space around a central negative mass, the speed of light is greater
>>than c. No quibble about that.
>>
>>But how do you get from that to " objects with negative mass can travel
>>at v > c"??? The object with the negative mass is *resting* in the
>>situation here, not travelling at any speed!
>
>
> The negative mass particle does not exceed the local speed of
> light, instead it increases the local speed of light to greater
> than c (c being our beloved speed of light in a vacuum).

[snip]

Dale Trynor wrote:
I had an idea for actually testing something similar to the idea above.

To get you started on understanding why I say this, do you remember the
generally used explanation for why gravity will slow time and or light.
We also know that if you are between two equally gravitating masses you
will not experience any effects of gravity. Now
ask yourself what would happen if you had what could be described as a
gravitational ladder ( it won't work but this is not important here )
out of a gravity well by suspending a string of small black holes in
such a way that one could climb up to geostationary orbit by staying
between the gravity where in such a way that you could leave the planets
surface without any expenditure of energy. Note also that if such a
thing were possible the very basis for time dilation where light becomes
blue shifted and of higher frequency would also not occur and such light
could reach the planets surface without the time dilating effects of
gravity .If such a thing were possible it would behave very similarly to
the descriptions of a worm hole in this way. It results in a situation
where time would have the same rate at both ends.

Of course such a thing cannot work however something similar to this
might. Now ask yourself what might happen for two black holes in free
fall towords each other and how would our light photons behave that
hitched a ride between the two gravitys. Such a situation could in
theory allow our photons to arrive at its surface without any of the
doppler shifting one needs to show for the original time dilation effects.

Now this gets interesting when trying to model how our astronaut in a
free fall orbit around one of the black holes in different locations
might view the arriving photons and or how he might view the speed of
the arriving light. Most importantly might we have an argument where a
brief area of fast time might briefly exist between the two black holes
where our astronaut might see what looks very much like a worm hole from
his prospective. He would also see light quickly travel
from what were originally distant points elsewhere on the same orbit
suddenly appear much closer and light from those originally distant
points arriving faster.

For the above to work its important to examine the idea that black holes
will not become trapped in their own time dilating effects in such a way
to never coalesce into a single one in our lifetimes. For this to be the
case one can also hypothesizes that if one were to assemble a string of
black holes into a rod that they would remain stable with infinite
rigidity. What I mean is if you had a rod made of black holes that they
could not even be bent without exceeding the local speed of light. This
needs to be examined more closely from the prospective of our up close
astronaut, on if he could detect the changes in gravity or etceteras in
such a way as to be considered a local light speed violation from his
prospective. If it can be argued that the violation can always be hidden
from him then this argument is not really a valid one and I really
haven't tried examining this idea as much as I should have as of this
time. Its reasonable to argue if this were the case with black holes one
can forget about any sort of testable FTL at this time, without even
starting to look at using weaker gravitating masses where such effects
might still be measurable but small.

If they do not become stuck in each others time dilating effects this
sort of temporary worm hole could possibly be created from the
prospective of our astronaut. This could still be argued by some to be a
violation of local light speed, however it also involves increasing the
light speed locally in such a way that it may not be a violation in the
more strict sense. This might be the sort of thing Ken S. Tucker, might
be talking about. If it works this way its not what I suppose you could
call a brute force violation.

Anyone got any ideas on what I missed or could give me something to
think about related to this.
Dale

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