Re: Gravity, Curvature vs Force

From: glbrad01 (glbrad01_at_insightbb.com)
Date: 10/09/04 

Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 15:10:19 GMT

"N:dlzc D:aol T:com (dlzc)" <N: dlzc1 D:cox T:net@nospam.com> wrote in
message news:D_w9d.9691$R43.6779@fed1read01...
> Dear glbrad01:
>
> "glbrad01" <glbrad01@insightbb.com> wrote in message
> news:LAw9d.435220$8_6.380864@attbi_s04...
>> Geez I would like to know why none of the rest of us can get out into
>> the far reaches of the Universe...
>
> Because we all have to invent our own private language, and expect
> everyone else to learn it. Rather than be clear, we get to be obtuse, and
> blame everyone else. Welcome to humanity.
>
> Do not top post.
>
> David A. Smith
>

  Thanks for reminding me about posting. It has been a while since I've
visited and posted to a newsgroup.

  For the rest, very well put. Discerning. First impression was to smile,
then "Now that is alright. Perfect as it lays." I thought I was the only
semanticist, and general semanticist by natural bent, around this joint.
Nice to know I'm not, even if this is your only entry ever in this newsgroup
that point to those disciplines. Man I would like to get more into that
"welcome to humanity" bit you wrote, take it up a level or two, but I'll
restrain myself for once.

  They have some cause for their vitriol though. I can't find any spatial
depth to Relativity anywhere, not really that is, after so many years of
looking for it, and I've realized, for myself at least, it is because Albert
Einstein and others traded it in either wittingly or unwittingly for "time"
as a fourth spatial dimension. Time is supposed to be depth in relativity.
No one that I've read and studied seems to realize that common sensibly,
even logically and wisely, the Universe would zero balance time, therefore
there is no depth to time and never will be. So, there is still no depth to
space in Relativity.

  There is one-dimensional thinking and thus one-dimensional perception of
what and how the Universe is; two-dimensional thinking and thus
two-dimensional perception of what and how the Universe is;
three-dimensional thinking and thus three-dimensional perception of what and
how the Universe is; and last but not least--at least here--four-dimensional
thinking and four-dimensional perception of what and how the Universe is.
Length, width, height and depth are self-similar, just as histories (pasts
(-t) - futures (+t)), frequencies (virtuals (virtual time)), relativity (as
in loss of regarding here and now and, concomitantly, gain in regarding
there and NOW), and zero (1. Present: 2. Now: 3. Universal Mean Time: 4.
Hawking time regarding the clock time of the clock of his "Grand Central
Station of the Universe": 5. Einstein's time factor found upon his arrival
at the speed of light after his mind's eye trip to the speed of light: 6.
Real-time 7. The when of material existence (thanks for this one, TomGee, I
hadn't thought of it in this way): 8. Time constant: 9. Time absolute) are
self-similar. Infinity's infinite (singularity), infinitesimal
(singularity), infinities (plural), and last but not least universal
constancy (universal constants, finite absolutes both natural and/or
artificially made so (such as infinitesimal being indistinguishable from
zero, thus at the other end, infinite being indistinguishable from one)),
also are self-similar. Finally, fundamental force's electro-magnetic,
electro-strong, electro-weak, and, yes regardless of arguments against it,
gravity, are self similar.

  The four dimensions each of space, time, infinity, and fundamental force,
are all fractal self-similar four-dimensionals. Space, time, infinity and
fundamental force are all--themselves--fractal self-similar
four-dimensional. An intertwining, interlocking, inter-dimensional,
inter-active and, to some degree, inter-changeable four-dimensional fractal
of four-dimensional fractals.

  The most difficult change in thinking concerning time is to realize that
time does not run past-present-future as far as the Universe at large is
concerned. It runs past (-t)-future (+t)-present (0). If I wanted to take a
trip to Alpha Centauri system from the Earth I would be beginning the trip
in minus time to the real current time of, at, Alpha Centauri. My own
reference frame here and now vis-a-vis Alpha Centauri would essentially be
one consistently about four years behind the current time frame at Alpha
Centauri, there and now (rather than the there and then of it that I have to
observe from approximately four light years in distance away).
Mathematically quantitatively, and qualitatively in actual travel, I have to
make up all of that negative four years as a future [additional] to whatever
travel time I would clock aboard my vessel during the voyage. The whole
result, the total result, including my own travel time in time, is every bit
of it the history of Alpha Centauri, there and then proceeding a negative
four light years to zero via a positive amount of time, until I arrive
actually at my destination there in my destination's space, now in time
vis-a-vis Alpha Centauri, me, the Earth, the Milky Way galaxy, and the
Universe at large. Astro-physicists, any physicists whatever that I've
noticed so far, in their math, never begin a trip on paper to anywhere
starting in negative time. They never start with, in, the negative time that
has to be made up in addition to travel time. Or, alternatively, they never
subtract the negative figure in time, the light time distance to any
destination, from their usual final result. This failure to realize that
light time distance to anywhere is a negative rather than positive figure
warps their final result all to hell and gone out of any reality.

  This failure goes much further in more areas in its repercussions. No
observer remaining on Earth will travel up through that history of Alpha
Centauri with the traveler even on paper. He will remain right where he was,
is, and always be parallel with the there and then of Alpha Centauri. He
will never arrive reach zero from the light time-distance negative, but the
traveler will always do it, providing--of course--he arrives. That is a
permanent, a constant, distance apart, a distance in time separation,
between the observer and traveler of four years (four light years) as long
as the traveler remains in the vicinity of Alpha Centauri and the observer
remains in the vicinity of Earth's Sun. Physicists remark, on paper, time
slowing for a traveler making such a trip at constant boost that would
accelerate them to somewhere closer to the speed of light--relative to the
observer remaining on Earth. But, light itself, and the speed of light, tell
us that no observer on Earth, no matter awesome the resolution of his
telescope, could possibly observe the time frame of a traveler's arrival at
Alpha Centauri (four light years away) until four years after the real time
of that arrival. The traveler will always arrive at that destination four
years before he observably arrives. So what is it that the observer would be
observing, has to be observing, during all this extended, unreal, time? The
observer of course observes an age for the traveler that is the age the
traveler was when he arrived four years before the observer observes him to
arrive. The light time image of the traveler, the only thing that arrives to
the possible observer back on Earth, lengthens out in time; the traveler
then appearing to have slowed down in time passage for him when in fact
nothing could be further from the truth. Once more, he actually arrives in
the vicinity of Alpha Centauri four years before that image of him
arrives--for the observer back on Earth.

  Starting immediately after the traveler's departure from the vicinity of
Earth, his observable image--to the observer on Earth--will begin gradually
falling behind the reality of the traveler and get further and further
behind the reality--along the entire route of travel--until finally it is
four years behind the reality of the traveler finally to stay four years
behind all reality at four light years distance in separation between the
observer on Earth and the traveler in the vicinity of Alpha Centauri. The
physical traveler going away from Earth, and the observer on Earth, will
gradually outrun the speed of light traveling back to the Earth, back to the
observer, bringing back to them his image. Farther and ever farther
outrunning it: pulling farther and ever farther ahead of it going away from
it, from the Earth, and from the observer able to observe nothing but it, in
space and time. None of this is reflected in the mathematical language--or
word language either--descriptions of how things look, are, and work, by
physicists. If the observer and the traveler were twin brothers, and if the
traveler made his trip in, say, four years across four light years distance
(that velocity supposedly dead stopping any advancement in time by the
traveler and the traveler's clock), then the physicist would tell us the
traveling twin not only looks four years younger but now [is in fact] four
years younger than his observer twin brother. When, in fact, they remain the
same age (all other possible factors being equal) because the traveler twin
in the vicinity of Alpha Centauri is now always four years older in reality
than the image being received back on Earth to his brother via the speed of
light (the speed of time advancement for all concerned). Always
remembering--in this modeling at least (I must make sure to remember to
always qualify my flat statements at some point in making them)--that the
end result of time advancement is "now," Universal Mean Time or universal
horizon time across the board, time at the speed of light, or flat zero (the
Universe implacably maintaining its zero balance with regard to time: No
accrual of time or expansion of the Universe).

  Again, even if the Universe were expanding (which I claim is nothing more
than a look of expansion caused by its infiniteness and an attached,
external, gravity field), the claims I make above should remain valid. A
Universe 13.7 billion light years in radius to the supposed farthest horizon
of it, and 13.7 billion years old in its supposed age, would be expanding at
an ever constant rate of the speed of light--putting the physical Universe,
and therefore us, on the skin of that expanding bubble doing the speed of
light, the speed of time, through space-time to nowhere: 300,000 kilometers
of space gained in the arrow per each second of time gained in the same
arrow, 10 trillion kilometers (rounded upward) of space gained per each year
of time gained, 13.7 billion times 10 trillion kilometers of space gained
along the arrow's length, the radius of the Universe, per each and every
13.7 billion years of time gained in the arrow's length in the radius of an
expansion of the Universe. Time at that speed of light, time in and of the
universal horizon, a universal, or cosmological, constant of zero time.
"Elementary, my dear Watson."

  "From a drop of water a logician could infer the possibility of an
Atlantic or a Niagara without having seen or heard one or the other. So all
life is a great chain, the nature of which is known whenever we are shown a
single link of it. Like all other arts, the Science of Deduction and
Analysis is one which can only be acquired by long and patient study, nor is
life long enough to allow any mortal to attain the highest possible
perfection in it. Before turning to those moral and mental aspects of the
matter which present the greatest difficulties, let the inquirer begin by
mastering more elementary problems. . . . That all united should fail to
enlighten the competent inquirer in any case is almost inconceivable." --
Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, A Study In Scarlet, published 1890.

Brad

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Basis of SR?
    ... spatiality of the Universe physically divides by time into innumerable ... boxes in TIME-LINE (thus all distant space-NOW disappearing: ... You the traveler, as the ... local observer sees and believes it to be. ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
  • Re: Basis of SR?
    ... spatiality of the Universe physically divides by time into innumerable ... boxes in TIME-LINE (thus all distant space-NOW disappearing: ... You the traveler, as the ... local observer sees and believes it to be. ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
  • Re: Gravity, Curvature vs Force
    ... >> the far reaches of the Universe... ... trip to Alpha Centauri system from the Earth I would be beginning the trip ... observer remaining on Earth will travel up through that history of Alpha ... Centauri with the traveler even on paper. ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
  • Re: Basis of SR?
    ... Nor, in fact, is there any such thing as the division of space and time in two, such that the spatiality of the Universe physically divides by time into innumerable boxes in TIME-LINE (thus all distant space-NOW disappearing: that is, PHYSICALLY ceasing to exist as anything having to do with PHYSICAL CURRENCY). ... You the traveler, as the accelerating expansionist, can encompass and enclose vast numbers of external non-local localities into the local woodwork of your own local frame. ... One photon can go through a vast number of separate slits all at once, with the localized possibility of there being just one observer per slit observing just one photon per each one -- and only one -- slit. ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
  • Re: I am Trying To Learn Relativity
    ... > be about 8.3 minutes behind the Earth, the Earth observer, and the> Earth ... He will insist that any traveler's clock, ... > traveler twin being NOW 8.3 minutes younger than when he was standing> next ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
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