Re: what is the relation between force and energy?

From: Andr? Michaud (srp_at_microtec.net)
Date: 10/17/04 

Date: 17 Oct 2004 15:57:14 -0700

"N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" <N: dlzc1 D:cox T:net@nospam.com> wrote in message news:<5jycd.2401$SW3.1789@fed1read01>...
> Dear Andr? Michaud:
>
> "Andr? Michaud" <srp@microtec.net> wrote in message
> news:562f286c.0410170654.3ccf909f@posting.google.com...
> > lvlus@hotmail.com (TomGee) wrote in message
> > news:<cc2dde17.0410162159.791bf54a@posting.google.com>...
> >> "N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" <N: dlzc1 D:cox T:net@nospam.com> wrote in
> >> message news:<pAhcd.2289$SW3.2185@fed1read01>...
> >> >
> >> > "ZZBunker" <zzbunker@netscape.net> wrote in message
> >> > news:e4a0829b.0410161420.a3f5dc2@posting.google.com...
> >> > > "N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" <N: dlzc1 D:cox T:net@nospam.com>
> >> > > wrote in message news:<Qiacd.2232$SW3.68@fed1read01>...
> >> >
> >> > The red shift or blue shift caused by gravitation is certainly related
> >> > to relativity. Just because one corrects for it, doesn't answer *why*
> >> > one has to correct for it.
> >> >
> >>
> >> But wasn't it Einstein who claimed in GR that curved space, and not
> >> gravitation, is real? Or was that just media hype, or more
> >> Theoretical Physics?
> >
> > Did you know that towards the end of his life, in the early 1950's,
> > Einstein himself was rejecting GR?
> >
> > Einstein suggested then that gravitation seemed to follow the laws
> > of electromagnetism. (See "Gravitation & Inertia", Wheeler and
> > Ciufolini, page 391).
>
> Do you have a quote from Einstein? I find publications by him until nearly
> the day of his death...
> For example "A New Form of the General Relativistic Field Equations",
> Annals of Mathematics, dated July 1955, by A. Einstein and B. Kaufman.
>
> Doesn't sound like "rejection" to me.
>

Yes. He never let go of trying to find a solution, any solution, even
trying to unify GR with QFT.

Unfortunately, I never could get hold of any quote other than this
very telling comment by Wheeler. I am confident however that Wheeler
would not have made such a comment idly if not grounded in solid
fact.
 
As for publication, I doubt that such a thesis, even by Einstein,
could have made it through peer review into formal publication.
"Too speculative" probably would have been the typical review board
comment, judging by Wheeler's remark.

Also, such pre-submission feedback as Wheeler's that could have
transpired in private conversations at the time may even have
discouraged him from formally presenting such a thesis.

Such a situation has not been unique.

In a similar case that I know of, there is no trace either of de
Broglie's thesis on the possible internal EM structure of photons
in formal publishing that I could get hold of, but in this case,
I could reconstitute the model from his many writings and obtain
confirmation from the de Broglie Foundation.

I had no such luck with the Einstein case.

I am still on the lookout for more info, of course, for historical
reference purposes, but 50 years have elapsed...

and anyway, the very idea was guideline enough for me to give the
option a thorough shakedown, which makes finding an actual quote
for my own purposes kind of moot. Simple topping on the cake.

Anyone else interested can of course go fishing (I'd sure appreciate
a word if something is found).

André Michaud

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