Re: Some Contradictory Claims in SR:

From: kenseto (kenseto_at_erinet.com)
Date: 02/11/05 

Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 15:04:18 GMT

"PD" <pdraper@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1108073897.486019.173590@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> kenseto wrote:
> > "PD" <pdraper@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:1108058561.743981.22830@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> > > kenseto wrote:
> > > > "Gregory L. Hansen" <glhansen@steel.ucs.indiana.edu> wrote in
> message
> > > > news:cudl3h$keg$1@rainier.uits.indiana.edu...
> > > > > In article
> <1107972609.661893.315380@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
> > > > > PD <pdraper@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >kenseto wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >> > length of a stick flying by at 20 m/s? Be careful here.
> I'm
> > > asking
> > > > > >you
> > > > > >> > do define length measurement.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Sigh....you don't and can't *measure* the length of a moving
> > > ruler.
> > > > > >You
> > > > > >> *predict* its length using IRT or LT. In the case of IRT it
> > > posits
> > > > > [...]
> > > > >
> > > > > >If all you can do is *predict* the length of a moving ruler,
> but
> > > you
> > > > > >can't measure it, then you can't test the prediction, and it
> > > becomes an
> > > > > >empty theory.
> > > > > >There MUST be a way to measure a moving ruler, to test the
> theory.
> > > What
> > > > > >is that way?
> > > > >
> > > > > He can't even predict it if he can't define length measurement.
> > > Whatever
> > > > > he predicts, he can't say that it is length if there is no
> > > definition of
> > > > > length to satisfy.
> > > >
> > > > Hummm...I wonder how Einstein do physics before the light-second
> was
> > > > invented to measure length.
> > > >
> > > > Ken Seto
> > >
> > > Precisely what I've been trying to tell you. He did, as did all
> > > physicists, APPROXIMATE physics using standard meter bar for length
> and
> > > assuming that length scales do not change. This worked well for
> > > inertial frames moving at low speeds with respect to each other.
> >
> > SR work quite well at any speed. In SR the physicval length of a
> moving
> > ruler does not change. The projection of a moving ruler changes
> according to
> > the factor gamma.
>
> Sigh, yourself. You asked how Einstein did physics BEFORE the rubber
> second, not WITH SR.
>
> I'm asking you the same question. How, using a non-rubber ruler and
> without invoking a light-second or SR, would you measure the length of
> an object sliding by at 20 m/s?

I already answered you. I said that you can't measure the length of an
object moving at 20m/s wrt you. You can predict its length (or light path
length) using SR or IRT.
>
> Once we have that procedure down and understood, you'll be able to
> understand why Einstein makes it clear that length measurement WILL NOT
> MEASURE a physical length of any kind, and in fact a physical length is
> not particularly well-defined. Hence the rubber ruler and the rubber
> second.

Physical length is well defined. Rubber ruler and rubber second were
invented to make the speed of light as a constant math ratio in all frames
as follows:
Light path length of physical rod (299,792,458m)/the universal time content
for a clock second co-moving with the rod.
This new definition for light speed makes SR compatible with the aether
concept. In fact makes SR into a special aether theory and that's why SR is
a subset of IRT.

Ken Seto

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