Re: Fraud in Experimental and Theoretical Science


"PD" <TheDraperFamily@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1139261359.271443.126590@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
| I believe you asserted that it had never been shown experimentally the
| light one direction was the same as the light measured in the other
| direction. Are you suggesting that we shouldn't use light for that
| measurement because that limits the measurement of light? Really?

No,
I have asserted that length contraction is a not a physical occurance,
and you have been twisting around the proof you said you have.
and you still are twisting now.
Are you ever going to prove the physical length contraction?


| What basic math is that?
| If I react three atoms of iron (Fe) with four molecules of water (H20),
| I observe getting iron oxide and hydrogen gas out. How many molecules
| of iron oxide and hydrogen gas do you think I should get, using your
| basic math?

that is not basic,
basic would be adding sames.
adding sames work fine with basic math.
Still twisting around so you don't have to answer the
length contraction thing huh?

| ============
|
|
| OK, moving on then:

finally.
Can't you just post the whole dang thing at once?

| So the fellas looking at the camera tapes now know why the yellow
| flashes were measured to be simultaneous on the 941 camera, but not on
| the 445 camera. Now they want to know why the blue flashes are
| simultaneous on the 445 camera, and not on the 941 camera.
|
|
| Well, of course, these fellas are no dopes, and they quickly figure out
|
| that exactly the same arguments that applied to the yellow bolts on the
|
| 941 ovibert apply to the blue bolts on the 445 ovibert. The blue bolts
| are not simultaneous as measured by the 941 camera because, according
| to the 445 camera at least, the 941 is heading into the light from one
| blue flash and running away from the light from the other blue flash.
|
|
| Well, all this is fine and good, but there remains the following
| observations:
| 941 camera: The yellowish bolts strike at the same time, and the bluish
|
| bolts do not.
| 445 camera: The bluish bolts strike at the same time, and the yellowish
|
| bolts do not.
|
|
| We understand *why* they see something different. What we don't know at
|
| this point is:WHICH ONE IS RIGHT? Are the yellowish bolts simultaneous
| or not? Or the bluish bolts simultaneous or not?

You need a third observation and a fourth etc..
but that is because you are not giving a physical motion
WRT the ground or some "stationery to Earth"
reference that can show if any of the bolts were actually simultaneous.


| The first instinct is to ask, well, which one is *really* moving? And
| here we get into the problem we had before. What constitutes "really
| moving"? How can we tell? If we look around and include the
| guidestrips, all we have is motion of the oviberts *relative* to those
| strips. Even if we include the pole in the distance that they both see,
|
| this motion is again *relative* motion, and we have no idea whether the
|
| pole in the distance is stationary or moving in any absolute sense.
| There is no anchor point where we can say, "This reference point right
| here I *know* is dead stationary."

To Earth there is such.
stationery to Earth gives Earthly simultaneous occurances
an actual meaning.
otherwise your "simultaneous" is not proven that it happened
at all.

| We can't even get at it from the light, because the light isn't
| traveling any faster in either direction on either ovibert. (This goes
| to the measurements I gave you citations for.) There is absolutely no
| distinguishing physics on either ovibert, nor using physics with
| anything in the environment, that can can tell me which ovibert is
| "truly" going faster than the other ovibert.

So you have a paradox that you can worship and
never find out the reality about it.
Woop De Doo!
:)
You love to twist around my board dropping mass thread
huh?

| And at this point we have a problem because it appears THERE IS NO
| PHYSICAL WAY TO RESOLVE THIS.

Not in your "no stationery to Earth" stupidity..
of course not..
LOL


| This would be really frustrating if we held to the belief that
| simultaneity can only be or not be true and that there is really only
| one absolute answer for these lightning bolts.
|
|
| But it MAY be that we are wrong about that assumption, wrong that
| simultaneity is an observer-indepedent property. In fact, what these
| observations and what the laws of physics are telling us is that
| simultaneity itself might be one of those properties that is an
| accident of which observer is making the measurement, and that there is

simultaneity is not an observer independent property.
It is a real occurance that can happen all the time.
It is your "lack of a larger frame" that is causing your
silly paradox and is also why you are ignoring my
board dropping mass thread.



| This is the point where you may have the sensation of something stuck
| in your throat. If you see a way out of this conclusion, I'll be glad
| to hear it.

The only think stuck in my throat is the simultaneous way
I am laughing and thinking you are a moron simultaneously.
LOL
:)

| As a status check, though, we are *very* close to figuring out why
| length is the same way.

No,
you are posting the same crap over and over and ignoring
the train experiment that was posted and the board dropping
mass thread and supplying a silly paradox that you invented
but will not allow an actual Earth based FoR' for it
because if you did you would lose your paradox.

PD,
you are truly losing your mind if you think this crap
you have thrown out is even close to proving length
contraction physically occurs.
In fact, it actually will come back and bite you.
since..
If such is all true.
you can not measure anything in reality
since to measure it,
you must have the end of the tape (L0), and the measured point.
(L1)
at both the beginning (L0) and the end of the object (L1) simultaneously.
:)





.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Fraud in Experimental and Theoretical Science
    ... | measurement because that limits the measurement of light? ... | flashes were measured to be simultaneous on the 941 camera, ... | 941 ovibert apply to the blue bolts on the 445 ovibert. ... | simultaneity is an observer-indepedent property. ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: Fraud in Experimental and Theoretical Science
    ... | measurement because that limits the measurement of light? ... | 941 ovibert apply to the blue bolts on the 445 ovibert. ... WRT the ground or some "stationery to Earth" ... IS NO ACTUAL fact of simultaneity. ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: Fraud in Experimental and Theoretical Science
    ... Measurements that are "limited" by light being used for such measurements. ... So the fellas looking at the camera tapes now know why the yellow ... 941 ovibert apply to the blue bolts on the 445 ovibert. ... simultaneity is an observer-indepedent property. ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: Fraud in Experimental and Theoretical Science
    ... We know how to synchronize clocks that have been set down at rest ... Simultaneity is not a property that has "actualness". ... let's go back to our original ovibert for now. ... that's the only way the length measurement makes any sense. ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: A little challenge for relativists.
    ... I never said simultaneity was a measurement. ... on the same numerical representations up to a lorentz transform ... Simultaneous points along the ruler have no causal ...
    (sci.physics.relativity)
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