Re: The standard of time and identical clocks

On Jun 25, 5:23 pm, "Spaceman" <space...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Sue... wrote:
On Jun 25, 4:40 pm, "Spaceman" <space...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Sue... wrote:
On Jun 25, 12:32 pm, "Spaceman"
<space...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
It all comes down to relatvists claiming that
the clocks are identical so therefore they are
keeping identical time in thier own frames.

Suppose a projectile fired into a bucket of water raises
the temperature 1.0 deg C.

A second projectile raises the temperature
of an identical bucket by 1.2 deg C.

Have you any way of knowing if the second
projectile was:

- hotter, faster or heavier -

than the first, given only the mass of the water and
the temperature increase for each bucket?

Irrelavant really,

You are picking up the "relatvist's" vocabulary quite
nicely. Perhaps you will be claiming you ARE a
"relatavist" tomorrow.

Temperature is a physical measurement that is abstracted from the
particle motion and physical frictional forces inside the container.
(or whatever definition you wish to think)
Temperature is not a mathematical measurement alone that is
abstracted
by the "supposed to be invariant periodic counting" of an objects
motion. (the ticker)

What if you have a two thermometers that differ in rate changes?

What if you answer a simple question in calorimetry?

Say one thermometer says the heat increased by 20 degrees
but another one measuring the same stuff that should be changing
at the same rate according to the identical make up
of the thermometers but it measures it to be 21 degrees or even 22
degress? If you do have such.. Are both the thermometers correct?

Would it be cheating to put both of them in the same water
to calibrate them?

Could you mark one thermometer to match the other?

(please don't waste bandwidth answering
rhetorical questions.)

Or is one miscalibrated or being influenced by another force?
Or are you going to say the temp rate change caused the temp rate to
change. and call it relative temperature dilation?
Like they pull with the clock changing rate problem?

Or will you look for what physically caused one thermometer to be
different than the other?
I simply am looking for what physically caused the rate change.
Is that wrong?
Or is that part of the physical sciences?

The question suggest three *physical* differences
that could cause the 0.2 deg C difference.

Yes, but all three physical differences are
based upon one, the final heat input
so the heat is final factor.
And the best fact of all is they are actual physical
changes occuring to cause the differences.
But that is unlike the clock problem that comes with
a non physical cause for times rates to change.
Or do you think there is a link between the heat change
and the clock malfunction?
:)

<< The second projectile might be
- hotter, faster or heavier - >>

Can you discern which *physical*
quantity was responsible for the
difference in temperature rise?

The heat that was added.
what else would it be?
:)

Can a fast heavy bullet heat the water
just as well as a slow lightweight bullet ?

Yes of course, it all still depends on the heat
of the bullet.
so now.. your turn.
Explain how two identical clocks could have
different time rates show on them when they are brought
back together yet they still ticked at the same "physical" rate.

You don't know what "time" is so it would be a waste
of bandwidth.

BTW... bandwidth is really cheap these days so
you can do some fairly simple maths to acertain
what others think your keystrokes are worth if
they have some concern about the bandwidth
used. ;-)


Hint:
<< invariance with respect to time translation gives the
well known law of conservation of energy>>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noether's_theorem#Applications



Do you really think "time changed rate" or do you think
at least one clock goofed up in it's supposed standard by a physical
cause that is being ignored?

See the Noether's theorem above. ^
Time changes rate when the looser of a drag race
crosses the finish line with less fuel than the winner
crosses with.


The standard has a problem if the clocks are not agreeing
on such a standard.
There is a physical problem with the clocks an it is:???

You are babbling about "time" and you can't even
define it in a physical context.

What can a bucket of water and a thermometer
tell us about "time's" symmetry partner "energy"?
http://www.owlnet.rice.edu/~chem312/Handouts%20Folder/Joule_etc./Joule.paddle.html

Sue...


--
James M Driscoll Jr
Spaceman

.

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