Re: EM pollution threatens with breakdown of Earth's magnetic field

On Jul 9, 12:58 pm, Marvin Barley <mtodorov3...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Jul 9, 6:18 pm, "n...@xxxxxxx" <Alien8...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 8, 11:50 pm, Marvin Barley <mtodorov3...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 8, 4:53 am, "n...@xxxxxxx" <Alien8...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 6, 3:58 am, Marvin Barley <mtodorov3...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Apart from potentially confusing bees and causing them to die having
lost orientation,

That's just silly. The Earth's natural field flaps and billows
around constantly due to entirely natural causes, mostly the
inconstant solar wind and flares whanging into it; bees have dealt
with that for many millions of years. It's not as if there were
permanent, natural "flux line" highways in the sky that bees depended
on until evil, inconsiderate humans started screwing with technology.

exponentially growing magnetic pollution from cellphones

Bees can't "see" AC (meaning Alternating Current as in RF, Radio
Frequency) fields, just DC (Direct Current, as in not changing over
time) fields. Hence cellphones, powerlines, and stuff like that
(anything measured in cycles per second AKA Hertz) don't bother them.

and other sources of EM field could cause the breakdown of
Earth's natural magnetic field.

Strong enough EMF from man-made magnetic pollution could demagnetize
Earth's core if strong enough

Utter nonsense; you obviously have no idea what "strong enough"
means.

The Earth's field is only about a half-Gauss at the surface but it's
generated by roughly six-billion-Ampere currents flowing in the liquid
(mostly) iron outer core which is as large as the entire planet Mars.
In order to alter the Earth's field significantly (over and above the
hundreds of billions of megajoules it has naturally varied in the last
hundred years or so) we'd have to apply at least that much energy,
deliberately concentrated as a DC field opposing that of the Earth.

If you knew ANYTHING about electricity you'd be laughing
hysterically at the technological imagery such an effort necessarily
implies.

or in accidental superposition.

Please don't use words when you don't know their meanings.

The result: Earth loses magnetosphere and Solar radiation and cosmic
rays penetrate the atmosphere with nearly full strength, causing
damage to electric appliances, but also causing exponential growth of
skin cancer and possible threat to life on Earth.

Whose utter, complete bull*** are you parroting? Let me guess;
Green Nazis.

I feel humble doing it, while you have the position from above
ridiculing me, just like when they told your kind the Earth isn't
flat.

"My kind". It so happens I never believed the Earth was flat.

No, But you believe Earth is unbreakable. Both are mainstream beliefs
of the times. It started to change only recently.

Your "your kind" comment above added to your presumption to know
what I believe reveals your arrogance.

Just twenty years ago serious scientists were mocking global warming
theory and ice cap melting possibility with threat to coastal cities
was science fiction.

Now you want to move the goal posts.

Just thirty years ago "serious scientists" were touting global
_cooling_ as the Next Big Disaster. Guess what the alleged cause and
suggested cure were? Yep, excessive hydrocarbon fuel usage, and
cutting back severely.

When that failed to gain traction AGW was trotted out. Same alleged
cause and cure.

BTW you _are_ aware that Earth isn't the only planet in this solar
system warming up? Care to blame that on manmade CO2?

If you care to try to actually dispute anything I wrote, feel free
to do so. Otherwise, if you do not want to be "ridiculed"*, please
refrain from posting ridiculous nonsense particularly when it's clear
that you don't understand at any significant level _why_ it's
nonsense.

You haven't scientifically disproved anything I said.

I falsified your "concerns" about bees; they are effectively blind
to cellphone (and all other radio) frequencies. They have dealt
successfully with natural variations, reversals, _and_ zeroings of the
Earth's field for as long as they've existed.

(If you're really worried about bees, worry about Colony Collapse
Disorder.)

If you knew anything about electromagnetism you'd know I falsified
your "concerns" about human technology affecting, much less
demagnetizing Earth's core.

A guy said
magnetic field falls with 1/r^3. I've checked my memory and Biot-
Savart law says it falls with 1/r^2 for infinitesimal "magnetic
charge", but since that doesn't exists, the magnetic field for a
endless wire is I * 1/r. The monitors may not have 50,000 V, but they
certainly have 24,000 V, which is not an order of magnitude lower.

I am not "a guy". However, since you brought it up, I have a
question for you; what do you believe is the connection between the
(contained) voltage of (obsolete) CRT monitors and "breaking down" the
Earth's magnetic field?

Such is the reasoning of all other "scientific arguments" that break
down my theory.

AFAICT you don't yet have a theory, just a bunch of handwaving
arguments derived from ignorance.

This far I don't have simulation model (yet), only a thought
experiment.

But most of physics wasn't much more in the beginning of 1900. It is
only a false assumption that tensors, extensive matrices and
supercomputers make up for a lack of idea.

You don't need supercomputers, you just need to get a handle on the
concept of "cause and effect". So far you have not described any
causes that could produce the effects you claim to worry about.

* This is a science group, hence it isn't about humility or pride;
it's about getting the facts straight. Just be glad Uncle Al didn't
light into you.

A science group should not address mental health issues upon emerging
of a new idea. What would happen if they've given Heisenberg a pill?

Humility may be a metaphysical issue rather than scientific, but true
knowledge is usually accompanied with the awareness of it's fragility.

I am aware there were scientists with difficult characters.

Non sequitur.

Nevertheless, Google on "electromagnetic pollution"; link 1 and 2 will
back enough of my claims, though not the possibility of magnetosphere
breakdown or core depolarization due to human-induced interference.

Apparently you don't know that Google doesn't necessarily return the
exact same search results for everyone. Care to provide URLs?

Probably there would be a tenfold increase in cancer, memory problems
and (guess) Alzheimer before that.

Have you ever heard of the New York City subway system? It's
electrically powered. Riders typically sit within feet of mega-ampere
conductors (generating multi-Tesla fields) switching at apparent
random. One would think there'd be a correlatable increase in such
illnesses among habitual subway riders over that of the general
population, but there isn't.

There also isn't a correlatable proportional increase of such
illnesses among electrical workers (specifically high-voltage linemen)
over that of the general population.

So no, there probably wouldn't.

Just imagine exponentially growing energy consumption. There will be
bigger power plants and inevitably more of stronger long distance high
voltage power lines. We all know that there is a tendency to put merge
all those systems together, so they'd be in phase - which brings
stability of power, and synergic cooperation of generators, instead of
phase cancellation of electric voltage waves.

That's an obsolete artifact of timing systems that used the 60 Hz
powerline frequency as a master timing reference. These days we use
radio signals from atomic clocks, and longline interties are DC, not
AC. There is no reason to think that your power, wherever you are, is
in any particular phase relationship to mine.

This means that we don't have just a problem of a 24,000 V, 200,000 nT

First, are you not aware that CRTs (the type of high-voltage-
operated vacuum tube display device used in old-fashioned TVs and
monitors) are obsolete? No manufacturers are building new facilities
to make them; they're all going to various kinds of flat-panel
displays which use far less power.

Also, what system of units? Did you mean nanoTesla? Flat panel
displays do not use high voltages, meaning they don't use flyback
transformers. BTW do you know what kind of voltage multiplier most
flat-panel displays use to run their backlights?

http://www.fuji-piezo.com/piezo.htm

transformer in a single monitor, but all electric appliances will
produce magnetic field IN PHASE.

If everyone owns the exact same obsolete model, places them in the
exact same orientation, and operates them from power sources in the
exact same phase. This WILL NOT happen.

Horizontal components will due to
random placement in space cancel out each other, while the vertical
components will superimpose and add up.

Where did you get that idea?

Which means 200,000,000 monitors and TV sets of USA in sync pulsing 60
Hz.

With every sentence you reveal your scientific and technological
ignorance.

Now, imagine world economy outgrows hunger problem in third world and
they all start earning enough to buy a TV and a computer. This means 3
fold increase in world consumption of energy, at least.

Nope. Display power usage drops dramatically with every
technological generation. The next generation will use what's today
called "smart paper" and the most power-hungry component will be the
backlight.

Now, don't ask me refs and calcs, that is your (scientist's) job. OK,
if I think it could happen in next 5 years I'd probably do more
homework. Right now it is a THEORETICAL POSSIBILITY.

No, it's not. You admit that you're parroting somebody else's claims
and that you have no "refs and calcs", but when I refute you using
"refs and calcs" you deny that your second-hand claims have been
refuted. Yours is not a scientific attitude, it's a religious one.

So enjoy your crusade but stop claiming to have scientific backing
for any of your claims.


Mark L. Fergerson
.

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