Re: Decoherence does not help explain collapse of the wave function

On Jul 14, 1:14 am, "Neil B." <neil_del...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"Trish Raggens" <trishragg...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

On Jul 13, 9:16 am, "Neil B." <neil_del...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Thanks for the reply, Trish. [If I leave out quoting, it's from failure
of my OE to add the chev-brackets] I have an open mind but am not yet on
board with the psychic angle. However, it may offer some insight into
unusual experiences etc. I guess you already went to

Also, your statement "superpositions still occur but are lost in the
massive entanglement between objects and environment." is not, pardon
the pun, a coherent notion. It is just the sort of post-modernish
fluff I usually hear from deconauts. I guess you picked it up
in grad school. The phrase "lost in" doesn't really say or explain
anything. It is not rigorous, it sounds like psychobabble applied to
physics. I mean, both states are still there, and yet we only observe
one outcome. And furthermore, we can have superpositions of orthogonal
basis states - they supposedly don't even interfere anyway, but the
collapse will select one out and make the other go poof. (Well, even the
term "interference" is sloppy. It is a way of talking about the results
of the squaring of the net amplitude superposition, when those results
show different phases at different places or times. But the rigorous
expression would be, "superposition of amplitudes." That happens anytime
the waves are together, regardless of how consistent their phases are.
Question for deconauts: do you believe in superposition, or not? And if
"yes", then it shouldn't matter whether this or that revealing pattern
is formed thereby. That's just an ensemble characterization. The theory
says the waves are all still there  together, until some weird
cosmic pluck pulls out an outcome.

I was just half kidding on the psychic connections. Anyway.
I own these two books about Decoherence:

Decoherence and the Quantum-to-Classical Transition

Decoherence and the Appearance of a Classical World in Quantum Theory

Have you read them? If not, read them first to be well acquainted
with the concepts like Quantum Darwism, Selection of the
Preferred Basis. Einselection, etc. Note that decoherence is
kinda a new field that veteran physicists (Copenhagenly trained)
like Uncle Al has not read about as folks like him are trained in
physics right up to the electroweak unification which they have
mastered. Beyond it are speculatory physics like string theory and
decoherence. But decoherence makes sense. Wave function
collapse are more hocus focus if you would reflect on it.



Relevant Pages

  • Re: The only true theory of everything would not be discovered by a physicist
    ... the wave function can collapse is already faced out. ... is decoherence with many experiments to boot. ... copenhagen says there is a division between quantum ... in the pre1990 physics don't bother to read about decoherence. ...
  • Re: Quantum physics - Collapse of quantum wavefunction
    ... basic ideas of quantum mechanics. ... Majority of physicists believe in the concept of decoherence. ... the wave function doesn't collapse. ... causing the superposition to go out of phase and the subsequence ...
  • Re: Wave Function of Molecules
    ... superposition principle says that you calculate the probability ... So why do you keep saying that even if decoherence occurs, ... When talking about a phenomenon involving coherence, for example, I ... would describe it as a coherent quantum superposition. ...
  • Re: Quantum spookiness in the brain?
    ... identical brains will think absolutely the same thoughts and make ... have absolutely identical brains because of quantum uncertainty. ... factor behind consciousness since it was the only part of physics left ... Particle quantum states can be in superposition. ...
  • Disproof of Quantum Decoherence
    ... proof or disproof of the principle of quantum "decoherence". ... of wave function versus decoherence. ... the quantum superposition of states ... In collapse of the wave function. ...