Re: FWIW: ST Enterprise Cancelled

From: Pat Flannery (flanner_at_daktel.com)
Date: 02/05/05 

Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 23:27:08 -0600

Andre Lieven wrote:

>
>
>>Instead, he waited till the man he criticizes was dead, and couldn't
>>offer a rebuttal to his charges...in my opinion, particularly given that
>>this is just about a single script for episode of a one hour television
>>program, his behavior in this matter impresses me both as extremely
>>petty and indeed wretched and base.
>>
>>
>
>That strikes me as a double standard: The *evidence* of not only
>Roddenberry's lies, but others, is amply made in Ellison's book.
>
>Why is your ire only aimed at the recipient of the lies, and *not*
>their tellers ?
>
>
Okay... here's one for you...since it didn't cost too much to film, and
since the characters were apparently acting in, rather than out of,
charecter...why didn't they just film it the way Harlan wanted them to?
There doesn't seem to be any problem with it, so why didn't they just go
for it? If you're writing for a episodic television series, then the
producers of the series have the right to tell you what you will and
will not do with their continuing characters and overall storyline, as
they are the ones who have to live with how their characters and overall
feel of the show get modified in any particular episode, and how that
will affect future episodes of the series.
If they had it all to do over again, I doubt there would ever be an
Organian Treaty, as it screwed the whole Federation/Klingon rivalry up
royally...in fact, that's why they were very careful to tell the writers
for STTNG just what they could and couldn't do so as not to paint
themselves into a corner like that again.
You have an anthology series like Twilight Zone, and you can have far
more room to do what you want, but when you come to a series like Star
Trek, then you should realize that they, not you, have the final say in
how things should be done. You can run your car in the race- provided
you are going the direction everybody else is, and don't start pouring
nails on the track.

>
>
>>This guy -not to put too fine a point on it- is a world-class ***.
>>
>>
>
>No proof offered ? Claim fails.
>
>

Okay, you prove to me that he's a nice guy. This ax can swing both ways.

>
>
>>I'm glad you inspired me to do some digging around for info on this
>>matter. Before I started this, I thought he was a sometimes amusing
>>loudmouth.
>>Now, I'd like to spit on the little ***.
>>
>>
>
>Well, ain't hate... pretty ?
>
><shudder> I thought that you're a gifted guy, Pat. Funny and
>creative as hell. I still do. But, this side of you, well, its
>nastier than anything that you criticise Ellison for.
>
>

Tearing somebody's reputation apart (and I know full well that
Roddenberry wasn't a saint by any standard) after there is no way he can
defend himself is a low thing; particularly when you do it around thirty
years after the presumed crime, rather than when your opponent can't
speak for himself in regards to your criticisms. Using terms like
"Great Pretender" "El Supremo" and "an outright naked liar" is pretty
rough by any standards, and the sort of language I'd expect from the
likes of Bill O'Reilly more than someone who considers himself a
thoughtful author.
In fact this whole thing reminds me of someone else...Spike Lee to be
precise; he complained when he didn't get an Oscar for what he thought
was good work, just like Harlan's tirade over no dramatic presentation
Hugo being awarded in some years. He also loves to stir up trouble that
he can be at the center of, like the idiotic attempt to sue Spike
network for their alleged use of his name; he also once did something
like "Dangerous Visions"- in his case it was "Spike And Company- Do It
Acappella" a CD collection of Acappella artists with guess who's picture
on the cover.
 Lot of great stories in "Dangerous Visions"- and Harlan's name on the
cover, and a story that is derivative of one of the other contributors
on the inside.

>Hate makes us worse than what we hate.
>

Well, Harlan certainly hated Roddenberry from his choice of language,
didn't he?

> And, when it's *personal*,
>thats the most reflective kind of hate of them all. Ugly, even.
>
>

You're right...I won't spit on Harlan if I ever meet him...I'll wait
till he's been dead for five years, and then pee on his grave.

Pat