Re: OT Mushroom cloud in N. Korea

From: Christian Ramos (cramos49_at_yahoo.co.nz)
Date: 09/20/04 

Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 23:53:25 GMT

Actually I think I've got it figured out. There is a tendency in any closed
industry to become a little incestious. A good indication of this is
normally when they repeat a mantra so often that it supplants facts.

Note George's attempt to justify Rand's credential's as a space Tourism
Expert.
To paraphrase,

He's was involved in a RLV startup, but dont know the name.
He was involved in many major projects but cant name them
He contributed to a major US study but he cant name it.
The statement that I should accept him as a expert because George Told me
so.
He's known at US conferences so he's an expert.
They state he often quotes references yet cant point to a single message in
the archive where he's provided one.

I wont even comment on the ridiculous inference by George that Major
corporations doing these studies and analyses would present such company
information at a Industry conference. They mentioned Space Access yet I cant
find a record of any of these companies who have completed the studies I've
seen having attended. In several cases the people dont even speak English so
I would like to see them try.

The problem with these types of closed groups is that they tend to spend
their time stroking their egos and patting themselves on the back about how
good they are, while at the same time boohah'ing anything that doesnt fit
their view of the world and putting down anyone with an idea that doesnt
match their view of the world. Note they also get very defensive when an
outsider asks them to justify one of their mantra calls. Given all the
attacks for asking Rand for a reference, this seems to fit. To be fair,
George communicated and showed some openess, but at the same time couldnt
help but throw in attacks against me.

I'm willing to except Rand may be a respected Space person for the US
community, but that just emphasis my point that he's not a space tourism
expert. Most of the in-depth analysis from a business and marketing
perspective I've seen on space tourism has been completed by Germans and in
particular the Japanese, the US has tended to focus on short term things
related to startup joy rides etc. His rejection of a major study and his
obvious lack of knowledge supports that.

So,

I'll continue to asks for references from anyone, especially given the great
response to such requests from other people.

I'll continue to show Rand the same respect he shows others in his posts.
ie: None at this time.

I'll treat any posts from Rand on Space Tourism with the disdain they
deserve

I'll pay more attention to his posts on Policy limited to the US, as that
seems to be his area. If he has worked as a Government Contractor as claimed
by George, then this should be an area he can contribute to.

I've blocked out this thread now, as it's deteriorating to farce. Anyone
want to make comments that I can see, feel free to pursue me offline, my
address is in the header. Those that want to make comments I cant see feel
free to go for it in this thread.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: OT Mushroom cloud in N. Korea
    ... space tourism business... ... in failed or not yet successful business efforts. ... I have never hired Rand, so I don't have his full resume. ... you of your anonymous sources? ...
    (sci.space.policy)
  • Re: Spaceship One - a partial sucess.
    ... Stephen Souter wrote: ... :>> space tourism industry through competition among the most ... how great its space shuttle would be? ... Rand thinks he's everybody's daddy. ...
    (sci.space.policy)
  • Re: OT Mushroom cloud in N. Korea
    ... > space tourism business... ... I'm aware of noone who has created a opreational space tourism business. ... Something Rand has never done according to the archives. ... Reference please..Whether he killfiles me now or not is irrelevant. ...
    (sci.space.policy)
  • Re: OT Mushroom cloud in N. Korea
    ... Rand Simberg wrote: ... I was the manager of the first Space Transportation Architecture Study ... but that just emphasis my point that he's not a space tourism ... Who are other sponsors willing to invest in the space tourism industry? ...
    (sci.space.policy)