Re: Manifold Space
- From: "jonathan" <Write@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 8 Apr 2006 21:34:00 -0400
"William Mook" <william.mook@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1144534066.532777.20530@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
That's right. But if life is as common as Drake implies in his most
optimistic value - one every 200 light years -
and if interstellar
travel is as easy as Bernal, Forward, vonNeuman and Dyson make it seem
- filling in 1 million years or so,
Why would a more advanced intelligence need to travel when
remote sensing is so much easier?
then the galaxy should already be
overrun with vonNeuman probes!
That is faulty logic. A more advanced intelligence will
know what is out there, or should be out there, without having
to go see it first hand. Our ignorance of nature and it's relentless
drive to create is the source of our assumption that we are alone
unless proven otherwise. A more advanced intelligence would
assume the opposite. A more advanced intelligence
will not need any 'sample' returns or the need for
interstellar travel.
It's a catch-22.
That's the point of the novel. And the
answer the novel gives, is, the universe is overrun - right now! Why
now? That's what the novel answers.
Why is it assumed any intelligent life will feel driven
to colonize other stars? What is there that can't
be provided here? And a basic property of evolution
is that life finds the optimum solutions, it tends to
stabalize over time. Assuming that alien civilizations
will need to constantly expand does not agree
with the characterisitics of life.
Which is a pretty dismal outcome for humanity, because we are not
long-lived enough,or constant enough to really compete in the
interstellar arena,
There is no competition, and there never will be.
Those civilizations that cannot sustain themselves from local
resources will never be around long enough to develop
interstellar travel. Another catch-22.
and our social structures are not up to the task of
creating long-term goals lasting tens of thousands of years. So,
humanity like so many short-lived terrestrial planet species is ignored
If there are advanced civilizations out there now, they would
be gazing down on us from afar. And the fact that we
need proof of their existence will tell them all they need
to know about our lack of wisdom. Which would provide
reason enough to ignore us.
My hobby is the abstract math of Darwinian evolution. And
there's only one thing we can be certain of. Which is that
life, intelligence and creation are the most probable final state
of evolutionary systems.
We can be sure that the future of humanity is to swim in beauty.
Which is what those more advanced civilizations out there, if they
exist, are doing right now.
That is the true reason we'll never find them, or they find us.
Wisdom eliminates the need to 'travel' and colonize.
in a galaxy replete with life while those with longer lives and more
constant ambitions achieve interstellar dominance.
Lol. Actually, if Baxter's vision is the correct one, one could argue
that an official policy of secrecy and non-engagement is an appropriate
one for humanity at this time - unless and until we develop the
capacities needed to compete effectively on the interstellar stage.
Our policy on first contact is reflected in the paper below.
It assumes the discovery of life elsewhere is inevitable
and not far off. It assumes the public will react poorly
if not violently. And that 'they' need to control first contact
for our own good. How nice of them~
NASA Technical Memorandum
WORKSHOP ON
THE SOCIETAL IMPLICATIONS OF ASTROBIOLOGY
FINAL REPORT
http://astrobiology.arc.nasa.gov/workshops/societal/societal_report.pdf
page 29
"The discovery may stimulate a worldwide resurgence in religious activity."
page 36
"One of the reasons for this is a sense of urgency: confirmation of
extraterrestrial life could occur at any time and in any of a number
of ways. When it occurs, we may have only limited control
over the situation."
page 6
" .... it is extremely important for us to be highly knowledgeable
about the likely reactions of different constituencies (the press, various
religious groups, political leaders, and the general public).
We would be foolish and negligent if we did not study such reactions
well ahead of time and make state-of-the art preparations for major
discoveries. Carefully prepared plans should be in place very
soon, because evidence of extraterrestrial life could be found
at any time."
page 31
"At that point we will not have to undertake lengthy preparations before
we can collect the information that we need to "manage" contact
and plan for the post-contact world."
page 22
"Many people still fight the concept of Darwinian evolution, and some
people may be truly fearful of extraterrestrial life. Some of these people
may use their political clout to deter astrobiology. For people who
believe that they were created in God's image, discoveries of other life
forms could prove devastating and perhaps lead to violent reactions.
Astrobiology could replace the Cold War as a source of ideas and
controversies. This could continue for decades."
Jonathan
Baxter points out that ETIs need not have the same sense of self that
humans exhibit. In fact, this sense of self might be considered
pathological in most other technical species. This gives us unique
problems, but also gives us unique strengths - which he develops more
fully in the novel.
.
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