Re: Opening the High Frontier of Space

Ian Parker <ianparker2@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

:On 24 Feb, 22:18, Fred J. McCall <fmcc...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> Ian Parker <ianpark...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:>
:> :On 23 Feb, 23:02, Fred J. McCall <fmcc...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> :> Ian Parker <ianpark...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> :>
:> :> :On 22 Feb, 14:18, Fred J. McCall <fmcc...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> :> :> Ian Parker <ianpark...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> :> :>
:> :> :> :On 17 Feb, 15:24, Fred J. McCall <fmcc...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> :> :> :> Ian Parker <ianpark...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
:> :> :> :>
:> :> :> :> :
:> :> :> :> :If asteroids became an economic source of
:> :> :> :> :platinoids to take an example, there would be no question about
:> :> :> :> :political cuts. The whole thing would be self sustaining with pure
:> :> :> :> :capitalism.
:> :> :> :> :
:> :> :> :>
:> :> :> :> Nothing like a tautological statement.  What's funny is that he
:> :> :> :> doesn't even realize he's doing it.
:> :> :> :>
:> :> :> :> If cows could fly, we'd all carry umbrellas when we went outside.
:> :> :> :>
:> :> :> :
:> :> :> :It is indeed tautological, but it is still worth pointing out.
:> :> :> :
:> :> :>
:> :> :> Not really, no.  Boiled down to its essence, what you've said is "If I
:> :> :> find gold in my back yard it's a gold mine".
:> :> :>
:> :> :> Meaningless noise.
:> :> :>
:> :> :> --
:> :> :> "Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
:> :> :>  territory."
:> :> :>                                       --G. Behn
:> :> :
:> :> :What I have said is you need Gold, Platinum or something which would
:> :> :make a profit for private enterprise to be interested.
:> :> :
:> :>
:> :> No, that's not what you said at all.
:> :>
:> :> :
:> :> :You get private
:> :> :space by demonstrating there is money to be made, not simly by pouring
:> :> :in massive government subsisies.
:> :> :
:> :> :Ceres Platinum might just work. It is at least worth debating. You
:> :> :need a requirement for Pt. You need electric cars.
:> :> :
:> :>
:> :> Yes, Ceres platinum might just work IF there is platinum and Ceres and
:> :> IF the price for platinum is enough to make going there, getting it,
:> :> and bringing it back profitable.
:> :>
:> :> In other words, it will be profitable if it is profitable.
:> :>
:> :> See what I mean?
:> :>
:> :> --
:> :> "Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
:> :>  territory."
:> :>                                       --G. Behn
:> :
:> :You are right when you say it depends on :-
:> :
:> :1) The price of Platinum.
:> :2) Whether Ceres contains Platinum.
:> :
:>
:> It depends on more than that.  It depends on whether it is easier to
:> get more platinum here at any given price point than it is to go to
:> Ceres to get it (including the development costs of all the new
:> equipment and techniques that would be required).  It depends on
:> substitution effects.  It's not the airy fairy wave of the hands that
:> so much of your 'logic' seems to be.
:>
:> :
:> :On "1" I feel that we have not fully worked out the consequences of a
:> :"green" world. We have to look at 9 billion people driving electric
:> :cars.
:> :
:>
:> Why?  We don't have the entire population of the world (including tiny
:> babies) driving cars now.  Why do you think that will change?
:>
:> :
:> :Each fuel cell has a requirement for precious metal. Is there
:> :enough to go round?
:> :
:>
:> Each car in the US CURRENTLY requires said metal for the catalytic
:> converter.
:>
:> :
:> :Now if you have a Capitalist system what is the consequence of not
:> :being enough to go round - the price goes up.
:> :
:>
:> True, perhaps.  Or you substitute other things.
:>
:> <snip irrelevancy>
:>
:> :
:> :On "2" does Ceres contain platinum. I think it is fairly clear that it
:> :does. Whether there is any differentiation of materials or not, I
:> :don't know. If there is the core will be particularly rich. We do not
:> :in fact know very much about Ceres. We don't know how it is made up,
:> :what is needed is a mission to land geophones at various points on the
:> :surface, and then to deliberately crash a few smart pebbles onto the
:> :surface. This would give us a map of the interior. There is ice
:> :present, there is rock present. Is it a layer of ice and a rocky/
:> :metallic core, or is it a mixture all the way to the centre.
:> :
:>
:> That won't tell you enough and it's probably cheaper to find more here
:> on Earth than develop Ceres.
:>
:> :
:> :As I said at first it is Hillary not Barack who is suffering. This
:> :leads me to the conclusion that no one really cares, it is the economy
:> :followed by Iraq. No one seems to really care. This of course implies
:> :that any future ventures must either be low cost or commercial.
:> :
:>
:> Space isn't an important enough issue to most folks to sway a vote.
:>
:> --
:> "Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
:>  territory."
:>                                       --G. Behn
:
:Yes of course it depends on that. Fundamental research is, of course,
:abour acquiring knowledge. That is why I advocate landing geophones on
:Ceres.
:
:If Ceres was once molten, I think there is a good chance that Earth
:based production could be undercut. Particularly if we are forced to
:open up Platinum mines where there is little Platinum per tonne of raw
:rock.
:

Let's see your business case.

--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Opening the High Frontier of Space
    ... :> find gold in my back yard it's a gold mine". ... :Ceres Platinum might just work. ... being enough to go round - the price goes up. ...
    (sci.space.policy)
  • Re: Opening the High Frontier of Space
    ... :>:make a profit for private enterprise to be interested. ... :>:Ceres Platinum might just work. ... :1) The price of Platinum. ...
    (sci.space.policy)
  • Re: Opening the High Frontier of Space
    ... :>:make a profit for private enterprise to be interested. ... :>:Ceres Platinum might just work. ... :1) The price of Platinum. ...
    (sci.space.policy)