Re: Retooling the Vision for Space Exploration
- From: Willie.Mookie@xxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 16:50:42 -0800 (PST)
On Feb 29, 11:36 am, simberg.interglo...@xxxxxxxxx (Rand Simberg)
wrote:
On Fri, 29 Feb 2008 08:12:38 -0800 (PST), in a place far, far away,
Willie.Moo...@xxxxxxxxx made the phosphor on my monitor glow in such a
way as to indicate that:
Good white Christian soldiers rousted people from their homes for
which they had a deed for, and had organized a government to protect,
that was recognized in documents signed by the Federal government.
This was done in the dead of winter, putting them on a forced march
through a blizzard with laggards being shot, and then those same good
Christians gave smallpox infected blankets to those who made it.
That's a myth.
Got references?
http://www.bradley.edu/las/eng/lotm/TrailofTears/trailparent.htm
http://www.cherokeebyblood.com/trailtears.htm
That isn't the soul of Christian kindness. It was done in the name
of racial purity.
What's your point? I never said anything about Christian kindness.
By implication you did - repeating myths of your own about supposed
Indian savagery as if that prove their culture had nothing of
substance to contribute to Americna culture.
We don't have to look further than the Spanish inquisition to find
people being flayed alive in the name of Christ and put to the torch
in the name of Christ.
I missed the part where I was defending the Spanish Inquisition. Can
you provide a citation?
You recounted myths about supposed Indian savagery as fact and called
it charming - ina way that suggested Indian culture had nothing to
contribute to the obviously more civilized American culture. So, it
is quite reasonable to point out that American culture draws heavily
on European history, and the Spanish Inqisition and other episodes of
violence and terror are part of that history.
You fail to see the point now, but seemed to be making one when you
recounted horror myths surrounding the Indian culture.
.
None of this makes Christianity itself evil.
I didn't say it did.
You implied that Indian culture was evil by your statement
Really? You mean like those charming cultures that flayed all the
skin off people, keeping them alive as long as possible, or buried
them up to their necks on ant hills with honey on their heads after
cutting off their eyelids, in the hot sun?
To the extent any of this was actually done - it has nothing to do
with the potential that culture has to contribute to American culture
generally.
The fact remains it is an historical fact that the US did not honor
the agreements we hed with the Native Americans, told lies about them
to justify our treatment of them, and treated them miserably to the
point of war without cause and isolated outselves from them out of
fear and was thus denied the very real contributions to our culture
they could have made.
And what contributions woulld those have been?
See? You know nothing about the culture except horror myths every
bit as questionable as the fact that US soldiers purposely spread
smallpox throughout native American tribes to reduce their numbers.
You presume they're a bunch of ignorant savages having nothing of
substance to contribute to modern culture or life.
I suggested two books earlier. I suggest you read them.
also
Dancing Between Two Worlds: Jung and the Native American Soul (Jung
and Spirituality) (Paperback)
I suggest, at the very least,- with a vital and powerful native
American culture and ethos - addiction and alcoholism and drug use
would not be on the scale they are today.
The US embracing the multi-culturalism imjplicit in our founding
documents would have prepared us well for the challenges of the 20th
century and likely have avoided our involvement in the European wars
in the first half of that century and given us treasures we can scarce
imagine.
There is no multi-culturalism implicit in our founding documents.
I suggest you read this from the United States Declaration of
Independence
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created
equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable
Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of
Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted
among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the
governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive
of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish
it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such
principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall
seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness
And that Amendment 1 of the Bill of Rights be examined
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or
prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of
speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to
assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Multi-culturalism is currently destroying Europe.
That's because there's no real solution - which would have been
created in America had the Sioux claims in Georgia been honored by
Jackson.
I submit that it is the western reaction to the challenges of multi-
culturaism that is destroying Europe. That fear of multiculturism is
destroying Europe. That lack of understanding and a valid model is
destroying Europe.
Had the US lived up to its promise to the people who lived under its
jurisdiction in the 19th century the US would have forged an exciting
and vibrant solution to what some historians called at the time the
Omega Point - a time when all cultures come into contact. We would
have been the role model.
Contact does not mean conflict, though in the absence of mutual
respect and multi-cultural society - its hard to concieve of such an
outcome.
.
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